What is with KOPB and KGW lately?

Feedback.pdxradio.com message board: Archives: Portland radio archives: 2008: Oct, Nov, Dec -- 2008: What is with KOPB and KGW lately?
Author: Motozak2
Tuesday, October 28, 2008 - 11:09 am
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Yeah, I realise this isn't *radio* proper. Isn't television just another form of radio communication as any other?? ;o)

Since last Friday, KOPB's ATSC feed (channel 27) and KGW's ATSC feed (46) have been going on and off air intermittently, generally being off the air for hours at a time (as in, most of the day.) Are they putting in new equipment at the towers or something? Faulty STLs, maybe?

As of the moment I write this, KGW and KOPB are (yet again) off the air, 0% signal on both my receivers (so I know it's *not* the way the antenna is rotated); KPXG (channel 4) is gone and KNMT (channel 45) has been M.I.A. since about 9:45 this morning.

What is going on?

Author: Stevethedj
Tuesday, October 28, 2008 - 12:15 pm
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could they be doing work on the main ant. system???

Author: Alfredo_t
Tuesday, October 28, 2008 - 12:50 pm
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Saturday night, KGW ran a "crawl" announcement that said that due to tower work, that station's DTV signal would be at significantly reduced power. Perhaps, the tower work is still going on.

Author: Motozak2
Tuesday, October 28, 2008 - 1:00 pm
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Are KOPB ATSC and KNMT ATSC both on the same tower as KGW?

Author: Chrisweiss
Tuesday, October 28, 2008 - 1:06 pm
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Ion is installing a new DTV antenna for channel 22. The old channel 54 antenna is being removed from the arbor at the top of the tower (hopefully today). Occupational RF exposure limits could not be achieved without shutting off KOPB and KGW digital signals during the daytime work (roughly 8am to 4pm).

New transmission line installation should begin after the antenna installation. This will require the FM stations on the Skyline master antenna to operate on their lower-elevation aux antennas for a couple of days during daylight hours.

Author: Alfredo_t
Tuesday, October 28, 2008 - 4:38 pm
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So, does this mean that the Ion TV Portland translator will be the first NTSC signal to go dark in this area? When will the Salem Channel 22 transmitter go dark?

Author: Semoochie
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 - 12:52 am
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I'll guess February 17, 2009

Author: Alfredo_t
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 - 1:07 pm
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Yesterday, I checked channel 54 and saw that it is off the air; apparently, there is no backup antenna. I cannot pick up channel 22 from my current location, so I have no clue about its status. I was also able to pick up channel 51 for the first time. This station was having technical difficulties with the sound.

Author: Chrisweiss
Wednesday, October 29, 2008 - 1:54 pm
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22 is running, but currently doesn't have much power. It will be a couple of weeks before the transmission line is all in place for the new 22 antenna. They were able to remove the 54 antenna and install the new 22 antenna yesterday.

Author: Kent_randles
Thursday, October 30, 2008 - 12:30 pm
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22 analog is still from their Silverton site.

Ch 4 is still their DTV, side-mounted on the Skyline tower.

54 will be back on when they finish installing the new broadband antenna, and technically could remain analog after February since it's an LPTV.

In February, 22 will be Ion's DTV channel.

I'll have to find out what 4 will become.

KNMT 24 is on the Sylvan tower, but may have been impacted by installation of the CBS FM antenna.

Author: Notalent
Thursday, October 30, 2008 - 2:07 pm
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Recently I had an interesting talk with one of the Seattle VHF TV engineers...

Seattle stations are opting to move to the UHF channels for their DTV and abandon the VHF.

Their reasoning is the upcoming proliferation of small DTV receivers in handheld or mobile devices such as cellphones, Iphone, etc.

Their logic being that the RX antenna required for a low band VHF would be inefficient in such a device. To be more compatable they are moving to the UHF frequency where a small antenna would be much more useful.

The interesting part of that is all the years of branding for ch 4, 5, and 7 will be gone in Feb, 09.

Author: Alfredo_t
Thursday, October 30, 2008 - 5:27 pm
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Up until now, 8-VSB has been too sensitive to changing multipath conditions to be usable in a mobile environment. Has somebody solved this problem AND gotten it to work with low enough power consumption to be usable in a mobile device?

Also why would the branding behind the channel numbers have to go away, as the DTV channel numbers are virtual?

Author: Jimbo
Friday, October 31, 2008 - 2:23 am
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"Seattle stations are opting to move to the UHF channels for their DTV and abandon the VHF."

Really!!
They had to go to UHF in the interim because there was no place else to go. It is true that currently the Seattle stations on lower and upper VHF plan to stay on the UHF channels.
However, the Tacoma stations on upper VHF are planning to go back to their VHF channels, as are the stations in Portland on 8, 10, and 12. The reason is simple and economical. They can operate at a fraction of the power and get the same coverage and that will lower their electric bill quite a bit. They can also use less power than they currently do for analog.

The lower VHF channels (2-6) do not behave well for digital television and most will stay on their UHF channels for DTV after the changeover. I think KOBI in Medford will go back to 5 for their DTV after the transition.

I think you will find this true in most places, including Medford and Eugene. KPDX will probably move their DT from 48 to 30 after the transition.
With KPDX dropping their digital from 48 and KGW dropping their DT from 46, that should clear up the digital noise that is now seen on KUNP analog on 47 in outer areas.

Kent's info above about CH22 and 4 is correct. I believe ch32 will go away and keep their DT on 33.

So, once these change, you'll have to rescan your tv/decoder box and you'll probably have to do it multiple times until all the changes are complete.

It won't be long until the fun starts and the phones ring off the hook with complaints.

Author: Motozak2
Friday, October 31, 2008 - 12:24 pm
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So, after next February, will KUNP on 47 be turning up its power somewhat?

Granted, I don't really speak much Spanish (but I understand a bit) and even with channel 48 moving, I imagine it will be great to watch "Sabado Gigante" without having to look at it through a big cloud of 8VSB hash!! ;o)

I understand KUNP in Salem will be converting to ATSC, flashcutting to channel 29. But will channel 47 become a little more powerful, or will it stay basically the way it already is?

(By the way: KGW and KOPB are on the air right now, blasting in loud and clear.....and I notice that the KOPB-FM simulcast on 10.05 has different graphics now........ ;o)

Author: Semoochie
Saturday, November 01, 2008 - 1:29 am
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I'm sure this is extremely temporary! Most of these low power stations and translators won't make the digital deadline because the FCC only recently began processing or even accepting their applications. Still, most are in the process. Since they are a secondary service, I doubt if the FCC will offer higher analog power for whatever time they have left.

Author: Pdxgary98
Tuesday, November 11, 2008 - 5:53 pm
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KATU I know will be on 43 which they are on now for their DTV.

Author: Semoochie
Tuesday, November 11, 2008 - 7:29 pm
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Briefly, the low Vs will stay put on their UHF channels. The high Vs will return to their original channels. KPDX will move to channel 30, evacuated by KPTV.

Author: Jimbo
Wednesday, November 12, 2008 - 4:50 pm
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"KATU I know will be on 43 which they are on now for their DTV."

This was covered three posts up.


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