I think Obama has a chance to insert nail in coffin tonight. I'm not sure what McCain will need to do to change the momentum. This town hall style debate will be interesting and I'm sure millions will be watching.

My predictions:

Faux News Idiots: McShame wins, game changer, drags Obama across the coals.

Conservative News Network: Both candidates did damage to each other, but we'll have to wait for the polls to know definitively who the winner is.

(... and on election day we'll know for sure ... )

MSNBC: Obama hammered McCain. Keith will be ecstatic, Rachel will show those pearly whites, and Pat Buchanan will scream at the top of his lungs to no avail.

I need to move two more tv's into the living room so I can watch and listen to all 3 at once.

I bet Obama won't be so "agreeable" with John McCain this time around. With him repeatedly saying that "John is right" or words to that effect in the first debate, that was the one area where Obama was most roundly criticized for. Don't look for him to admit that McCain is right about anything tonight. I do predict the word "wrong" to be used about as often as "maverick" was in the VP debate.

I'd love to see Obama call out McShame for the Keating debacle, just to see the veins start to pop on his neck.

I'm sure hope Keating will be brought up tonight, along with the losses in the Dow.

I suspect that if anyone tries a drinking game with "John is right" etc., you'll finish the evening as sober as I'll be.

Sadly, no one won the stuffed beaniebaby Pig with Lipstick at my VP debatewatching party.... because Sarah never DID say "I said Thanks but no Thanks." Partypooper.

McCain sounds O-L-D. His voice wavers, he gasps for air, and if he says "my friends" one more time I'm gonna scream.

I noticed the gasping as well. He's just too old and too out of touch.

However, disregarding the age issue, McCain lost this debate. He needed a game changer and he certainly did not get it. Obama came out swinging and there is no question that he's the champion of the middle class. I can't see any justification why the middle class should do without tax cuts in order for those at the top to get more.

I'm on the road in the Southwest, road trip. So I didn't see much of the debate - I'm watching a re-run in my hotel room now. But I did see McCain himself at a rally in Albuquerque on Monday. And yes, he does look very old in person and a bit tired:

http://www.portlandbridges.com/00,5D0IMG42461,287,1,0,0-politics.html

His speech contained several of the lines I heard him use in the debate tonight (or what I've heard anyway). The Monday speech was almost entirely "Obama bad" - red meat to his supporters. Almost nothing about what McCain would actually do. And that leads me to believe that most McCain voters are not voting for him, they're voting AGAINST Obama. It's hard to win an "anti" vote. Ask John Kerry aka "Anybody but Bush."

Andrew

Got to listen to some of it on the radio.

The format sucked. What I did hear was ok, but no followups. Brokaw was cranky too. Almost as if he wanted to make clear, over and over and over, that "it's the format" and if it sucks it's not his deal.

Yeah well, it sucked and I'm still tagging him for it.

Obama did a fine job putting the screws to McCain, in little 90 second bursts. (Yawn)

I played the "my friends" game, eating one of my road candies each time. Ran out on McCain.

Obama could have done way better, but lacked time to articluate his greater policy positions. McCain ignored ordinary people and generally didn't gain ground.

So, that's a moderate win for Obama and McCain treading water at his usual low point.

Can't we get one of these that's actually worth watching? We want the younger people into this stuff and we deliver them this?

No wonder they are on forums, u-tube and cell phones. This would just put them to sleep fast.


Ye

Well here is one for y'all :

From a person who has been a McCain supporter since about January.

McCain is loosing me here. He lost me last night when he started talking about this 300 billion dollar or another huge Govt. Agency called perhaps something like the Home Mortgate Relief Agency. These are my words , not his , because he didnt have the awarenes to even put a damned NAME on it for us citizens or to have a press release and float parts of the idea over last weekend ahead of the debate , as the these things are usually done. He is proposing that 300 billion dollars be apportioned , as yet , really, an unidentified source for this 300 B. This money McCain proposes to be used to 'buy down' some people's mortgages , probably on the principal owed to reduce the monthly payments so that they can stay in their homes and not go through foreclosure. Nice sentiment, but totally ill concieved , Socialistic and 'shoot from the hip' as far as I can tell. What agency is going to this? What beaurocrat is going to make the decision? Who chooses. Who and what criteria determines whether 'you' get a mortgage reduction/adjustment or your neighbor gets one. Eveybody with a mortgage would want to have their payment lowered and or principal reduced ! WTF ! This isnt reduction of Govt, this is a great expansion and intrusion of the Federal Government.

Even the Conservative Pundits were caught flat footed on this and many of them just freely admitted to it. Chris Wallace interviewed Mitt Romney last night right after the debate and asked Romney about this 300 billion Home Mortgage Bailout Plan of McCain's. Romney said " I dont know, this is the first I have heard of it " ! ? Your chief economic adivsor doesnt even know about this Plan? What the hell is up with that ! A plan that is so Socialistically audacious that it even raises the bar set by Franklin Roosevelt's New Deal of the 1930s.

He is loosing me here. The alternative is still (IMO) worse. So I am still with him. But he is reminding me of an ailing Patient on the wrong medications. Ideas with out critical details that could have been at least briefly mentioned last night.

All I could think about when watching McCain last night was Grandpa Munster. He really looked old when walking around the stage and sounded a little crazed at times. I think the "that one" comment didn't help him with a lot of voters.

> We want the younger people into this stuff and we deliver them this?
>
> No wonder they are on forums, u-tube and cell phones. This would just put them to sleep fast.

I don't mean to be overly dismissive, but how might a political debate be made to appeal more to young people while still addressing policy issues? I, for one, am glad that I haven't had to see the candidates have to answer questions about what kind of underwear they use.

Another question: with the 700+ billion dollars that are going to be spent on the mortgage lender bailout plan plus the additional 300 billion that McCain might throw at the problem, how is it going to be possible to give anybody a tax break? Where will the money come from?

That's a totally valid question!

Not dismissive at all.

Things I would do for younger people:

1. Pre-debate submit your questions with voting. This does a few things. It gets a collection of e-mail addresses and phone numbers. (if text voting is allowed)

2. Younger moderator. Perhaps give them 30 minutes to speak from their perspective. Have that moderator ask those questions from the pool of generated one and give them a bit of room to move and react.

3. Pre-debate show where we spend a bit of time on debates and why they matter. Present the policy stuff in terms of where we might be in 10 years. This will hit home and put things in context. Older people can tell their stories and connect them to key debates and then let the younger people see themselves as watching this debate, knowing it's gonna impact their future.

(there is generally a huge disconnect on this that impacts the ability of younger people to relate to and get value from these exchanges)

4. In the actual debate, let some stuff happen. Younger people are very focused on who people are. They get this information in a lot of ways and one of those is unplanned exchanges.

5. Yes, absolutely ask a question or two, or open the floor for the candidates to tell their story. All of us like stories. Younger people relate to stories very well. Does not have to be underwear!

If we fail to do this, we say that we just don't have time for them and what they think. Truth is, we do have time and will suffer under what they think soon enough. A little thinking about that brings some perspective no?

6. Post-debate reaction from people that younger people identify with and another round of voting / reaction.

This format sucked for just about everybody, and that's not ok, given the importance of it all.

Can we stop the "he looks old" comments? HE IS OLD!

The debate was a soggy bowl of cornflakes, but that was the one thing on the menu. Obama did quite well, in spite of being the only man on stage with his own teeth.

Things Younger than John McCain (and probably Tom Brokaw too).

Ya,

I saw a pundit on the news at noon. He said that he thought McCain looked like the old guy next door neighbor of " The Mitchells" on ' Dennis the Menace " ( Mr. Wilson)

...a cranky old man hobbling around pointing fingers at Obama and calling him " That one " ....

>>a cranky old man hobbling around

have your legs broken and re-broken in your mid-20's and 40 years later...wha-lah...

Thank God your still walking...
Would you all say the same things about your Grampa?

Would you all say the same things about your Grampa?

No.

Perhaps, it is because they were much harder workers, kinder people, more honest guys, better citizens, and exponentially smarter fellows than John McCain.

Perhaps, it is because one died when he was 30 years younger than John McCain and the other died when he was 14 years younger than John McCain.

Perhaps, it is because I love them and their children, while I do not love John McCain or his children.

Perhaps, it is because they never ran for President.

I suspect that if anyone tries a drinking game...

John McCain said "friends" or "my friends" twenty-two times last night. I suspect that there are a few fraternities waking up in pain right about now.

After watching the vice-presidential debate, a friend and I came up with the idea that a good drinking game would be to take a sip each time that the word "maverick" was uttered. Unfortunately, that wasn't a popular buzzword in the second Presidential debate.

No, but "my friends" would have worked!

I want to know something from the HARDLINE RIGHTIES.
McCain wasn't good enough in 2000 and was thrown under the bus by the Bush administration in 2004. Why O why is he good enough now???

Thats right , your arms and legs broken and not set correctly. Nevertheless, look at what things people say about him anyhow. Those impressions remain with people who dont know. Especially when
"attitude" is mixed in with it. Happens everyday, in workplaces and neighborhoods around the country. Human nature, even if left unsaid.

McCain is hardly a 'hardline righty"...The hardline righties dont really have a candidate this time. That is why he is good enough now.

Kennewickman ( I'm just going to call you KW from now on ), what's your take on Palin as a candidate for VP? I have moved on from it and am not trying to pick a fight ( and really, come to think of if, I don't even have a point ) - but I am curious about your opinion.

I email my family and friends a lot anyway, for years now. We have been emailing like crazy the last 9 months cause of this election free for all that we have all been part of in some way.

I posited to my "peeps" oh about the time we knew Joe Biden was to be Obama's VP, that all John McCain had to do was get a woman on his ticket and he would have a winner, or would be more likely to BE a winner if he did. We all had opinions as what woman should be on the ticket, then. So I just came up with Sarah Palin.

The Interesting thing is that I really didnt KNOW Sarah Palin. I had only seen several clips on her, I knew she was the Gov. of AK, and young, that was about it. I think I heard Bill Crystal talking about her once on Brit Hume's special report. On my part it was a pick that just seemed right for a guy like McCain at the time. A female , a newbie, someone who could be molded and would take orders and be real exiciting.

Well I was right. I am not always right, but this time I was. So, like the rest of the country now, I have come to know the public personna of Sarah Palin. And what is she. Upbeat, opinionated , a barracuda for sure, she sees politics as black and white pretty much, she is exiciting and she polarizes people for good or bad. And she is an attack Dog , like most VP candidates are supposed to be. She is a fairly quick study too. She brought to the ticket what McCain and his handlers wanted. Female excitement and aggresive political right wing Conservatism to molify the Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaughs of the world.

So now, is she making a difference and what is that difference NOW. I believe that she is NOT ready to be President yet. But she would probably be ready after a year or so in office, if they win. Next question is ; Do we want an ultra Conservative President butting heads with a Democratic Congress forever and a day? She would probaby be like former British PM Maggie Thatcher. Lots of fireworks, but at what cost to the country?

People like her ( and there are people like her on the Left too ) tend to be Idealogues. Promoting ( ie: legislating ) Ideals without acknowledging any practicality in the process, IMO, is a dangerous endeavor. Sometimes people change given enough time and seasoning. Sarah Palin needs seasoning, IMO.

So that is what I think. So do we take a chance that John McCain will live for at least 4 years or not? Its kind of like Shakespeare ; To Be or Not to Be ....THAT is the question !

Wow, you picked Palin?

I saw one clip before McCain picked her. At the time, I thought, "up and coming, that one" and suddenly there she is!

The question...

Man I could never do it! She is absolutely not ready. Dangerous actually. Sometimes not knowing any better is a bad quality. This is one of those times.

Sometimes it's a good quality, like the inventor that just gets it done, oblivious to all the critics insisting it's impossible. Good stuff.

But this is national policy here. Security, fate of the nation and all that.

Thanks for posting, BTW. I enjoy the perspective.

Without a teleprompter and hours and hours of coaching she sounds like she really knows NOTHING except that Russia is right next to Alaska.

Dangerous actually

I'd be hard pressed to tell you who is more dangerous -- Bush or Palin. Both are intellectually uncurious.

Chaney, on the other hand, knows exactly what he's doing, doesn't give a shat and is completely stunned how many times he's guessed wrong so far!

Ya and he is a 'bad shot' in his old age !

A co-worker and I had a political conversation the other day. He's a registered Republican, voted for Bush in 2000 and 2004, is pro-life and generally socially conservative. He said he's probably going to vote for Obama because he feels his choice of Sarah Palin is terrible judgment. I was shocked to hear this from him.

When I look at Sarah Palin and compare herself to me, I believe I know more about what's going on than she does. And somebody a 72 year old heartbeat away from being the most powerful person in the world needs to know more than I do. She's spectacularly unqualified in every area that can be measured and she's an extremist religious nutball who's sole purpose of her seeking higher office is so she can continue Bush's agenda of turning us into a theocracy.

Vitalogy-I have come across many staunch Republicans such as your co-worker, and they are either voting Obama, or sitting this one out. Palin is the biggest reason.

I have to admit that today I agreed with Obama on one thing. It is Hard for me to admit that I agree on much of anything with Barack Obama.

And that was his take of McCain's 300 billion dollar proposal to " Refinance/adjust and or buy back 10s of thousands of Home Mortgages AT FULL MARKET VALUE ! Some thought , after his grand presentation of this plan at the last debate, that it might be a partial buy back or a rate adjustment of said difficult or bad loans to individual home buyers. But oh no ! On his website , it says differently. Full market value. God ! And whats more his idea is to have the FHA refinance all of these, with private Banks assuming a percentage of the loan ( this yet to be determined ) ...The FHA is inundated NOW with reams and stacks of 3% down Mortgage applications that they cant possibly process for 3 months or more. This proposal of McCain's is a monstrosity, with so many holes in it for fraudulent activity no one will every be able to police it properly.

My father is 83. He is a dyed in the wool Republican. He is a retired Federal Employee who worked for FHA and the loan guaranty division of the V.A. He and I email all the time. He says he still cant vote for Obama , but after seeing all this stuff McCain is promising and wants to do, and having been in the Mortgage/Appraisal business in the private sector for 20 years and then 33 years in the Federal Govt as a Chief Appraiser he is more tempted this week to just NOT vote at all.

Dad knows how those Agencies work, and he is convinced that what McCain proposes is not only screwing the taxpayers even worse that the plan just started recently, but will get bogged down is so much red tape that people with no problems with their mortgages will apply. Also, people who have multiple homes are likely to slip by the system somehow taking advantage of the taxpayer even further. All or most due to the lack of control or oversight in an overburdened FHA . He still knows staff in both agenices and hears about all their issues. Next thing we will be seeing is another Binder and Binder spot on TV " Let us deal with the FHA to get you a new Mortgage, you have got enough to worry about".

No wonder the stock market keeps falling, investors , lenders and just about every 'joe sixpack' as Sarah likes to say cant figure out a damned thing most of these so called experts and politicians are talking about from one day to the next , or in McCains case , one debate to the next. Hell, when, McCain talked about this in the debate, he hadn't even mentioned it to his chief economic advisor, Mitt Romney !