Ailing Cuban leader Fidel Castro is tipping Democratic candidates Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama to team up and win the U.S. presidential election.

http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSN2825114320070829?feedType=RSS&f eedName=politicsNews&rpc=22&sp=true

While the Bay of Pigs was indeed a fiasco, at least JFK wasn't Castro's pal, unlike so many on the left today.

Herb

Herb.

Herb IGNORANTLY said>>>
While the Bay of Pigs was indeed a fiasco, at least JFK wasn't Castro's pal, unlike so many on the left today.

Endorsement doesn't mean friendship. If you believe that your just GD dumb.

There's no logic. Just something to say.

Move on.

Look.

If an avowed Nazi endorsed Mr. Bush, you guys would be all over it.

Herb

Hey Herb.....

Funny Thing....

Pink Floyd is one of my favorite groups and every time I hear "Lost For Words" I think to myself "Wow....They must have written that one for Herb".

Here are the lyrics:

I was spending my time in the doldrums
I was caught in a cauldron of hate
I felt persecuted and paralysed
I thought that everything else would just wait

While you are wasting your time on your enemies
Engulfed in a fever of spite
Beyond your tunnel vision reality fades
Like shadows into the night

To martyr yourself to caution
Is not going to help at all
Because therll be no safety in numbers
When the right one walks out of the door

Can you see your days blighted by darkness?
Is it true you beat your fists on the floor?
Stuck in a world of isolation
While the ivy grows over the door

So I open my door to my enemies
And I ask could we wipe the slate clean
But they tell me to please go fuck myself
You know you just cant win

Everytime I think of our war on terror, I'm amazed that many on the left actually think if we ignore the problem, it'll simply go away.

Living in a fantasy world only makes the situation worse.

Herb

"If an avowed Nazi endorsed Mr. Bush, you guys would be all over it."

I do not agree - but let's say you are right. If I did that, would you be convinced that there is somethign wrong with your party because someone you don't like gave you an unsolicited endorsement? Apparently you do. I never get any tongue in cheek from you.

Kiss me, you fool.

"Everytime I think of our war on terror, I'm amazed that many on the left actually think if we ignore the problem, it'll simply go away."

Yeah. That's not been shown to even happen. Show me ONE time in which " the left " has ignored a problem in hopes it will go away.

Ya, it never works. They tried for the last seven years but DUByah never went away!

Herb writes:
Everytime I think of our war on terror, I'm amazed that many on the left actually think if we ignore the problem, it'll simply go away.

Really. I'll bet you could name at least ONE PERSON on the "left" who has publicly stated that we should "ignore the problem" of terrorism. Right? Just one?

Or could it be that you are full of shit?

Andrew

Castro thinks he will get a better deal with Obama, no suprise there, the demos have been chompin at the bit to relax trade with Cuba.

I'm sorry......but I just can't go through life with:
http://liberty.davar.net/Images/Humor/PatrioticBlinders.jpg
I just won't buy into it!

Herb said>>>>
Living in a fantasy world only makes the situation worse.

Then maybe you should stop NOW!

"I'll bet you could name at least ONE PERSON on the "left" who has publicly stated that we should "ignore the problem" of terrorism."

http://dir.salon.com/story/news/feature/2003/11/15/amnesty/index.html

Herb

More EXTREME garbage from Herb....

I coudn't find that one person in that article. Will you at least name the name for us?

Sure.

Large groups are named:

War protestors of various stripes, alongside anti-globalization and human rights activists, have staged several large rallies nationwide this year, channeling their anger at the Bush administration through slogans like "No blood for oil," "End the imperialist occupation" and "Regime change begins at home." But in an interview with Salon, Schulz said that the political left has thus far botched a key mission. "There's been a failure to give the necessary attention, analysis and strategizing to the effort to counter terrorism and protect our fundamental right to security," he said. "It's a serious problem."

Schulz???

So your contention is that members of those " large groups " ignore terrorism in hopes that it will go away?

Like DUHbya and Co. ignore uninsured American's, the poor and anyone that doesn't think as them.

"..So your contention is that members of those " large groups " ignore terrorism.."

Yes, and it's being noted by one of their own, a fellow liberal. One could call it idealism, optimism, being unrealistic, whatever.

We weren't in Iraq and Afghanistan before 9/ll and it didn't keep terrorists from killing nearly 3,000 innocent people.

I just think it's naive to believe that if we leave, things will get better. They won't. Not only will terrorists have a victory under their belts, but then they'll also have control of a key strategic region along with control over the oil.

I wish we could leave.

Herb

Who is this fellow Liberal?

Well, Herb. You're wrong. Not only have you not proven wnat you initially tried to state as truth, you have made me dumber for even trying to engage with you on it as you slip and twist.

Go ahead, Herb. Say " follow us home." Come on. You know you want to.

You're done.

Just because someone is against the war in Iraq doesn't mean they want to ignore terrorism. Drawing that conclusion is ignorant.

Your right, but it does show their ignorant about areas of US vital interest.

Iraq was not of vital interest to us before our invasion, as has already been determined by the court of facts.

The people like me that were against the war from the get-go were smart, the people that fell for the sleazy sales job on the Iraq war were the ignorant ones.

Nwokie said>>>
Your right, but it does show their ignorant about areas of US vital interest.

HOW ABOUT WHAT'S GOING ON IN AMERICA??? Isn't that VITAL interest???

Castro has been dead for a least a year, Herb.

>>>"the court of facts"

Where is this court located?

Here Mrs. Merkin, I'll save you taking up bandwidth reproducing all of these news stories. People can get them direct by themselves.

http://www.drudgereport.com/

Come on, Herb - take back the gratuitous comment about anyone on the "left" saying they thought we should ignore terrorism, since you can't produce a single name of anyone who has said such a thing. It's just something you made up or heard on Hannity. Otherwise, you're are completely full of shit.

Andrew

"...you can't produce a single name..."

Wait a minute. A fellow liberal takes entire liberal groups to task for being soft on terror. And I'M the bad guy?

You're either open to re-examining your lock-step devotion to leftist positions or you are not.

Herb

"Castro has been dead for a least a year, Herb."

Mrs. Merkin, if that's true, the Cuban people will indeed have a shot at freedom. Providing Castro's brother doesn't stand in the way.

Herb

Herb said>>>You're either open to re-examining your lock-step devotion to leftist positions or you are not.

Like yours for EXTREME RIGHT positions??

Let's see...I've distanced myself from Mr. Bush's positions on big tobacco, outsourcing, the border, along with other positions.

If anyone is lockstep, it's the left.

Herb

Herb writes:
Wait a minute. A fellow liberal takes entire liberal groups to task for being soft on terror. And I'M the bad guy?

No, not a bad guy, just full of shit and a liar. As usual, unable to back up your ridiculous claim with any sort of facts. Then again, that's what most of us expect from you by now, so I wouldn't sweat it.

Andrew

Right on cue!
Keep it up Herr Herb. Come November next year you and your EXTREME base will have destroyed anything you have LEFT and Hillary will win. Thanks a lot Herr Herb!

This is rich, and I don't mean Marc Rich, either.

The left has twisted itself into so much of a pretzel that it's now willing to sacrifice the head of the liberal Amnesty International, rather than admit their own soft policies on terror.

Your hatred of Mr. Bush is destroying your own party in front of everyone.

I could see throwing plenty of your fellow travelers under the bus, but this takes the cake.

You can't indeed make this stuff up.

Herb

Right on Cue Herr Herb!

When it comes to YOU EXTREMEIES it's simply PRICELESS!

Herb writes:
You can't indeed make this stuff up.

I can't make stuff up but apparently you can, all day.

ONE NAME, Herb, of ANYONE (on the left OR the right, ANYONE) who has said the US should "ignore" terrorism. ONE NAME, Herb, or STFU.

Andrew

We're waiting..... And while your waiting Herr Herb.
LOOK AT THIS....

http://www.nationalpriorities.org/Cost-of-War/Cost-of-War-3.html

Whoop! Whoop! Whoop!
(Alarm goes off in Herrb's tiny little black/white/no-gray-matter head/brain/or whatever)

Abort! Abort! Abort Mission!

Warning! Nothing of fact to substantiate with!
DUCK!
JAB!
Now bring out the usual supsects: Ham, fists, wringing, Nixon, Pope and water buckets, anything, hominums, abortion, ACLU...think fast!

SWERVE!

NEW TOPIC!

Attempt Thread Highjack manuever to thwart topic onto something, anything, else!

OK, I've got something! Let's try this one whilst praying it works:

"The left has twisted itself into so much of a pretzel that it's now willing to sacrifice the head of the liberal Amnesty International, rather than admit their own soft policies on terror."

Troll.

But Trix, that's just so damn "soft" of you.

That will be HerrB's PROOF that you support the terrorists! Silly Rabbit!

He doesn't know me from the hole in the basement window he looks out every day. I could really care less what he thinks of me. I live in America where I can think anything I want. I can be a TRUE Republican and not believe in DUHbya. That's my right!
If Herr Herb wants to think that support terrorism then that's he own ignorance. Which is probably the case.

That interview with William Shulz is an interesting read, if we can put aside the reason it was linked.

"ONE NAME, Herb, of ANYONE (on the left OR the right, ANYONE) who has said the US should "ignore" terrorism."

Ward Churchill.

Link?

>>Link?

Place your cursor over the underlined text, then left-click.

I'm confused . . . who am I supposed be in lock-step with? obama? castro? schultz? bin laden? the prez?

*takes off tin foil cap*

Whoa, being a sheep ain't easy. I wonder how they do it.

Maybe a DEVO Energy Dome would work better.

Herr Herb..... we are waiting for that link....

Vit: >>>"the court of facts"

Deane: Where is this court located?

Been thinking about this. I knew what was meant, but had some trouble nailing it down.

The court of facts exists in our political discourse. That includes all of it, not just a few "authorities". If one chooses to consume their information from a reasonably diverse set of sources, the debate between them (often implied with conflicting opinion), will then reveal positions and or statements that survive peer review.

That is the court of facts; namely, those things that remain solid after considerable discourse.

"..we are waiting for that link...."

You won't have any problem googling all the information you need on Ward Churchill.

He beats your below the radar leftist who's soft on terror.

This liberal Einstein cheerfully pointed out that the the thousands of innocent civilians murdered on 9/11 were equivalent to Nazis, calling them 'little Eichmann's.'

Given the left's hatred for our president and the good he's trying to do in fighting terror, I won't hold my breath waiting for Ward Churchill's fellow liberals to distance themselves from such evil and untrue statements.

Herb

Herb, I don't have any more patience arguing with you when you lie so blatantly and obviously and refuse to back off from it. Best of luck to you.

Andrew

Classic.

Flip the chess board over, when your evidence you request is provided.

I'd be angry too.

Herb

I'm still waiting for the link. I don't have time to google Ward Churchill. I'd like to see where he said "the US should ignore terrorism".

You say you've provided the evidence, but I don't see it. But as is the norm, you won't be able to back it up with facts.

If you're gonna spout off some bullshit, expect to back it up.

Herr Herb said>>>
Flip the chess board over, when your evidence you request is provided.

WOW! Herr Herb is always right on cue. Keep it up Herr Herb and YOU EXTREMEIES will bounce your asses right out of Washington. Isn't many LEFT in YOUR pack thank the Lord!

Herr Herb said>>>
leftist who's soft on terror.

WHO?

Not "soft" on terror (that's a judgment call) - who said "the US should ignore terrorism." NO ONE.

Andrew

Herr Herb said>>>
thousands of innocent civilians murdered on 9/11 were equivalent to Nazis.

As YOU also think of the INNOCENT women and CHILDREN of Iraq.

I'd like to see where he said "the US should ignore terrorism".

These are politicians. Look at their actions in tandem with their words.

Dick Durbin didn't want to admit he's soft on terror-like Ward Churchill, he knows he'd be pilloried. But when Durbin tore down our soldiers, he compared our US troops to Nazis and likened our actions like those of gulags. You don't think that's far worse than any politician admitting they could be stronger on terror?

Wake up.

Herb

Translation:

Nobody has actually stated a position that is soft on terror, but I really, really need to validate mine on the assumption that it's true, so I'll just imply it, stir the pot nice and hard and hope something good shakes out.

Herb, there just has to be some give and take here. You write laced with labels, poor inferences (and some really good ones too, that's not my intent to say anything bad, just pointing out how that's tied to the labels), continue to affirm positions where the burden has not been met, etc....

Just look at this stuff:

left's hatred for our president

left's hatred for our troops

lock-step devotion to leftist positions

leftist... (with lots of interesting variations)

..if it were a Republican (That one has some merit, depending)

grey, weak, hand wring, ham fists, pro abortion, anti faith,...

Most all of this stuff has been hashed out here multiple times, and the burden on most of it just hasn't been met, is known to be inflammatory, and generally does not add significant value to the conversation as a whole.

Additionally, there is a ton of mouth stuffing going on. I'm gonna call it the Stuff 'n Bluff™!

eg:

pro-abortion / abortion on demand

One who is pro-choice simply believes each of us must decide what is right. That's it, end of story. This is not encouraging abortion, yet many if all your references to this matter, imply that fact as if everyone, who does not tow the same line you do, is just itching to abort, murder the moment they get the chance, and they encourage their friends to do so as well.

(Again, that's not a thread hijack, just an example of the Stuff 'n Bluff™, made clear.)

It's all slippery and very difficult to engage as it often takes a short book to sort out the stuffing, from the meat!

Back on topic:

There is nobody that matters that is soft on terror. Nobody.

Again, it's strongly implied that if one don't tow the Herb line, then one is soft on terror, despite the fact that there are multiple approaches to the problem, many with historical support for having been viable and reasonable.

A difference in approach to the problem of terror just does not imply soft, and that's the crux right there. We've explored a lot of those approaches here, and lots of good ideas came from that. If our elected leadership were actually able to debate one another, without the Stuffing and Bluffing™ going on, perhaps we might just see some progress.

However, as long as this kind of seriously divisive behavior is going on, we will end up with essentially nothing!

All of this crap is divisive, as in I'm right, you are left (wrong), and there just is no middle ground, BS.

As usual, Herb puts words into peoples mouths and has no proof of his statements other than that they are his misguided and misinformed opinions.

Pro choice argument 1850 style, (We'll I wouldnt own a slave, but I think its a personal choice for those that do".

Interesting analogy, Nwokie. Seriously.

So a person can be pro-choice and anti-abortion. Correct?

Of course, but at what cost do you ignore the plight of those without protection?

Of course, it depends how you define "those." Some people don't think a 2 week old embryo or a pre-embryotic blastocyst deserves "protection" over the life and health of the woman in which it is inside. If a pregnant woman's life is in danger after the first trimester, thanks to recent laws her doctor can't perform an abortion to save her life. I'm just glad we have taken medical decisions out of the hands of physicians and put them in the hands of politicians, where they belong.

Andrew

Agreed!

And I am a pro-choice person, who is anti-abortion, BTW.

It is pretty obvious to me, from looking at this thread, that Herb wanted arguing and finger-pointing, and that's what he got! The issues of terrorism and abortion are not relevant here.

The question behind this thread was, why did Castro (or ghostwriters in the Cuban government) endorse Obama/Clinton. How do people in the Cuban administration think that they would benefit from the victory of such a ticket? The article didn't answer this question. I'd be interested in some facts that might indicate the real motives of the Cuban government. "Nwokie" suggested that they might be betting that an Obama/Clinton administration might ease or eliminate trade restrictions with Cuba.

Does anyone really take an endorsement by Fidel Castro seriously? It's obvious to me that this near-dead Cuban leader revels in getting attention and influencing American politics any way he can.

Andrew

What it does show, is that Cuban officials dont understand how our election process works. Publicly supporting one candidate by them will do more harm for that candidate than good. Almost no candidate will campaign on the idea "Castro likes me".

By the way, trying to pass off the idea that unsolicited endorsements indicate affiliation is pretty dangerous. Just ask Joe McCarthy (OK, you can't because he's dead). In his famous televised rebuttal against Edward R. Murrow & CBS News, he read excerpts from a Communist publication wherein that publication's editor praised Murrow's "See It Now" show. McCarthy expected that viewers would assume that such praise was irrefutable proof that Murrow himself must be Red. Unfortunately for Tailgunner Joe, most viewers saw the logical fallacy in this.

Fidel Castro IS dead.

> [The Cuban government's] Publicly supporting one
> candidate by them will do more harm for that
> candidate than good.

This is very true, and it is funny. I need to start listening to Radio Havana on shortwave again (for a laugh). The political commentary on that radio station tries to pass itself off as "progressive." However, I don't believe that there are many Americans, regardless of political beliefs or affiliations, who take the Cuban government seriously in this day and age. The fact that this is a government that most likely is covering up the death of its leader and that goes out of its way to jam American propaganda broadcasts (Radio Marti) says a lot, in my opinion.

"I don't believe that there are many Americans, regardless of political beliefs or affiliations, who take the Cuban government seriously in this day and age."

Alfredo, you are so busted! Herb is peeing his pants right now because he now realizes that you're not taking hios bait and eating up his wormy rhetoric.

I agree, 99% of people in the US don't give a rat's hiney about the Island of Cuba.

And no, Herrbocrite, I don't have a link.

The troll confirms daily that he is indeed a troll.

I almost agree with you Mrs_Merkin, except I think about 5% think castro was a great leader, who except for the opressive policies of the US would have lead the American Hemisphere into communist glory. Another 5% think castro is the anti Christ, and blame the US for not stomping him out when we had the chance.

The other 90% think castro is a subdivision of san Francisco where the gays live.

No way.

23 percent of us think that. That's the same 23 percent that think a lot of other goofy things too. Most of them watch Billo regularly.

The remainder fall into either of the small percentage catagories listed, or just relate Cuba to cigars, music, or some other basic thing.

And fly fishing.