HD Radio around the corner perhaps?

That's been their intention all along! I thought it would be up and running before now.

could be now I have a reason to look into my own AM stereo transmitter if this means that HD is around the corner KDZR is the only AM stereo station which can be received in southwest Washington during the day as KLOG 1490 shut off their stereo around 2005.

1640 HD is supposed to be on by the end of the week!

The holdup was getting two HD transmitters to like one antenna system.

in that case I will be listening and might give reception reports on here as both 1630 and 1650 are clear during the daytime hours KDZR HD should be receivable but getting the stereo will require a strong signal

I look forward to hearing a music format in "HD" on the AM band.

it will be interesting and in the expanded band too where KDZR is pretty much alone so the conditions will be ideal for the upper and lower digital sidebands.

I always just figured KDZR was waiting for the authorization to go 24/7 HD. Can't wait to hear it this weekend!

Hey Kent,

What was the resolution to get HD cooperating for both KDZR and KKPZ? Any particular tricks?

They just turned on the HD (about 5:50). I think it sounds decent (for AM), analog delay is pretty close, but I hear some "echo" as the radio switches to HD.

Are HD receivers available at a reasonable price yet?

LOL, I just found the Panasonic CQ-CB9900U HD car deck for $849.99. Ridiculous! The radio industry needs to help get the cost down on these things! Are they THAT expensive to produce. Holy shit.

For that price, the faceplate should be diamond studded and 24K gold plated. I don't think its available anymore, though...might be an old price.

The JVC in dash unit is around $200...and not too bad of a deal.

can't get HD from KDZR too much skywave interference

just got the ID but that it is the sidebands are still clean enough for audio but no decoding yet

brief audio decoding a while ago sounds great but no stereo tonight should be able to get the stereo tomorrow when the conditions are a little better

Oh man, I got off work early (about 4:50) and got home about 5:45... I listened to KDZR on the way home hoping to hear them do some HD testing... Well, I know what I'll be listening to tomorrow!

I'll have to try getting recording an aircheck...

I might make an aircheck but I still can't get over this fact for a 10 KW HD station KDZR has a heck of a signal here their HD signal maxed out the meter on my receiver at a few points KEX just barely lights up 3 segments at best!

I don't believe it needs a stronger signal to decode stereo if it gets an HD signal. I'm pretty sure it's either there or it isn't.

with the Accurian HD receiver the signal must be moderately strong to get stereo if the signal is weak which would be 2 or 3 segments on the signal meter then stereo reception is not possible and digital reception will be difficult.

This is the first I've heard of it! Why would a stereo signal be harder to receive than a monaural one when both are digital?

There is a such thing as "core mode" on AM HD. when the receiver is in a low signal area it will decode at 20kbps in mono. when the signal improves the stereo light will come on and you will be getting the full 32kbps bandwidth (and stereo).

In a car stereo this fringe area may be very small and not noticable.

My stereo light only works in analog.

My old first generation Sanyo HD1990M (which does not have HD-2 or 3) has a stereo indicator that seems to function to indicate full or core mode in AM. There was some discussion about the blinking stereo indication in the thread about KPOJ HD (when they were testing a year or two ago) but I can't find the thread. I did not know at the time what the stereo light was indicating or why it was blinking... Thanks, Notalent for clearing up that mystery.

OBTW Shane, the Panasonic CQ-CB9900U is a similar first generation radio (one of the first offered) I think the list price was close to $1000. This radio is obsolete now, having no HD-2 or HD-3 reception... How old was that listing? The JVC is a much better radio, and under $200!

Anybody hear any KDZR HD today yet?

the HD was just switched on their ID suddenly appeared on my receiver but no audio yet I am located 65 miles to the north in the fringe area of KDZR.

"There is a such thing as "core mode" on AM HD. when the receiver is in a low signal area it will decode at 20kbps in mono. when the signal improves the stereo light will come on and you will be getting the full 32kbps bandwidth (and stereo)."

In concept, this sounds almost like the old "Surestream" thing Real Audio used to use years ago (maybe still does?) Depending on the quality of your connection, i.e. if you were on a mediocre dial-up connection and listening to a Surestream programme on your computer, the Real Audio software would gradually lower the bitrate until it came in without breaking up.

O, how I yearn for the technology of those wond'rous days of yore....... ;o)

the concept really does sound similar to Real Audio Surestream. Listening to KDZR right now they just have the ID up now only very brief audio at times it is not because of my reception I am getting the digital sidebands perfectly and the receiver locks onto the ID after only 1 to 2 seconds.

Hmmmmmm..........could I be a'smellin' a technology infringement lawsuit a'brewin'? Real Networks Inc. vs. Ibiquity, perhaps?

Whoop sorry, my bad.......turns out it's actually my cousin's grilled cheese sandwich a'burnin'.............. :oO

Here's my reception report:

Location: Wilsonville
Time: 12:05-12:20

Display:
KDZR
KDZR, Portland, OR

Notes:
Locked on without issues and no breakups at all. About two bars on my Panasonic HD car radio and ST light came right on.

I listed to about 3 or 4 songs and there was no apparent stereo separation, like they are feeding the HD encoder with a mono signal and sounded like it was a bit loud (little dynamic range).

Once they are feeding the encoder with a good left/right signal the audio quality will improve a lot, especially since the iBiquity codec really prefers a true stereo signal.

As a good example, I would suggest listening to the music bumpers on KEX. The hosts on KEX don't sound too good since they feed left/right audio equally (mono), but one the music comes up it's extremely crisp and clear with excellent dynamic range and stereo separation.

this is really surprising the Radio Disney satellite feed is stereo and the transmitter should still be wired for stereo.

KD7YUF:

I was surprised to! My guess is that all the audio processing is still being worked on...

makes sense the engineer working on this will have to make some processing adjustments for the digital side in order to have the best possible sound quality.

Is the Radio Disney Sat feed 15kHz stereo?

I know most of the sat formats for FM's are but this one was destined for AM stations some of which were analog stereo.

They may have been using the cheaper 7.5kHz stereo satellite channels since this was primarily for AM.

Anybody know?

There are FM Radio Disney affiliates.

On my wide band AM stereo tuner, I got stereo audio out to 10 KHz. It was never very good audio, but it was out to 10.

Yes, I'm positive that they are given a FM quality stereo feed as they have a lot of FM affiliates. I believe they're primarily on the eastern US.

that sounds about right Radio Disney has a couple in the midwest as well one in Little Rock AR and another FM one in Indianapolis IN

$100 HD Radio at http://www.radiosophy.com/products/hd100.html

Review at http://www.radioworld.com/pages/s.0051/t.8139.html

Apparently, it's only in HD when I'm not listening! I listened from about 10AM to 10:30 and again around 7:30PM. I haven't heard it yet.

I caught KDZR HD around 11:00 AM and this continued until local sunset around 9:00 PM

My HD radio has a tough time locking into 1640's HD.

And when it does lock in it has a tough time staying in stereo.

Clearly there are still some adjustments to be made.

Local sunset in August is 8:15. I listened until I got to the Milwaukie Expressway and discovered KOOL. The HD signal just wasn't there!

my receiver has a hard time locking on the the audio too but this is with my main LF/AM/SW antenna a 1000' longwire. With the Radio Shack 8" loop the audio lock seems to be a bit more reliable on the longwire their ID shows up after about 1 second. On the loop the HD indicator lights up and then the ID is displayed after locking onto the audio.

Perhaps, I'm not being clear: My receiver has no diffeculty locking on to an HD signal. There wasn't one! Maybe, it will be up when I am, tomorrow.

I got 1640's HD in Centralia today!

I tried it on my way to work and it was still gone but finally heard it on the way home. It seemed to do fine as far as reception goes. I wasn't crazy about the sound quality but that varied from one song to the next. Maybe something will sound good eventually. Isn't Centralia way beyond their 0.5mv/m contour?

Maybe the Columbia provides exceptional ground conductivity in that direction?

it is I think their 0.5 mv/m contour is just a little south of where I am but with a good receiver and antenna HD reception is possible in fringe areas. I doubt the Columbia River is providing good ground conductivity it is because the SNR of the sidebands is high enough to provide good reception remember 1630 and 1650 are vacant during the daytime hours.

I just discovered I've been reading the radio-locator maps wrong all this time! I thought it was 2.5, 1.5 and 0.5mv/m. It's 2.5, 0.5 and 0.15mv/m! Centralia appears to be way outside even the 0.15mv/m contour!

Dberichon sez:

"I got 1640's HD in Centralia today!"

That is great reception! What HD tuner/radio and antenna are you using? I have to use an outside antenna (about 100 ft) coupled to a Sangean HDT-1 to get a solid HD lock on 1640 from Hillsboro.

On a related topic, I tried to DX KITI (95.1) last night, but no luck due to KSND In the days before the KSND move-in, KITI was weak but could be heard here. Congratulations on the job there!

jr_tech says:

"I tried to DX KITI (95.1) last night, but no luck due to KSND"

there are ways FM DXers have been using phasers for situations like this with excellent results I don't know the theory but the device usually is a small box with a couple of antenna inputs and one output. What has to be done is the antennas have to be about a half wave apart one antenna is aimed a the station you want to receive and the other is aimed at the station to be nulled. With a little adjustment of the controls it will seem like the unwanted station is off the air.

Yes! I have done that before, but I did not take the time last night to play with "phasing"... my second FM antenna is at the other end of the house, and connected to another tuner. What I usually do is use an attenuator to match the amplitude of the undesired signal from the main antenna and the second "phase" antenna, using an Icom VHF receiver (which has a S-meter), then mess with different lengths of coax to the "phase" antenna to get the signal to cancel that on the main antenna (180 degrees out). I have also tried L-C networks to adjust phase, but I never got one that would function through the FM band without resorting to some coax length adjustment.
But back to KDZR... I seem to be getting better lock today with just an inside loop, perhaps they are still adjusting power levels?

I used to get 105.5 no problem throughout much of the Eastern metro area (and still do, although I haven't really listened to it since it was KLYK/Magic); Rocket 107 in Northeast Portland, including some parts of the Banfield; and now 98.3 The Peak in many of the same places I used to get then-KLYK. Was never able to pick up KITI even pre-KSND move-in, although it was a station I specifically tried to receive.

I was just using my car's HD radio. It's the Panisonic radio. My car has a long whip antenna.

It didn't stay locked in very long, but I heard it for a few seconds. The HD light stayed on through out my drive.

I'll be interested to see how KEX does up here once they run HD at night time. I was able to hear it during the day. It would drop back to analog on a regular basis. It was more solid then 1640 was.

Jr_tech:

Thanks! Although I should say that you didn't miss much last night.

I may be on the AM soon, and I think you would have better luck hearing that in Portland. I use to pick it up with regularity. Just have to make sure you are far enough away from 1410 (which isn't too hard.)

might be possible all that is needed is a good receiver and antenna. I can say for a fact this helps tremendously on the setup I use for Trans-Pacific AM DX KITI is normally S-9+10 however the station is barely audible on a normal receiver with a bar antenna.

Slightly off topic:

On a Labor Day weekend road trip I had the chance to hear KWSU 1250 HD. The audio quality of the digital signal was quite good.

I've always thought their analog audio was somewhat muddy, this is quite an improvement for them.

Sounds like they use minimal audio processing which may be the key for reducing artifacts on AM HD.

Notalent:

I agree, from what I can tell the issue right now with KDZR is that the HD audio is being compressed way too much (too loud) and the codec needs a nice dynamic range to be effective...

On another note, I believe they are encoding a stereo signal, however it's hard to tell as the codec is freaking out due to the loudness of the audio...

did anyone care about am stereo to begin with?