I just recently saw a picture on the Internet. Of a light rail train in Seattle. Does this mean Seattle is starting catch up with Portland.

It has taken 20 years for Portland to build it's light rail system - and some would say it's still not extensive enough to be a useful train system. Others would say it's a huge waste of money. (Others, like me, would say that while public transit is a worthy use of public money, MAX is a poorly designed system and probably not the best use of taxpayer's money as designed). So it seems unlikely Seattle will be catching up anytime soon.

Andrew

Though we have been using MAX more recently, especially to the airport, I would agree with Andrew's assessment.

Oh, yah...Seattle has a lot of catching up to do. They are just now getting into major construction. First line isn't set to open for atleast a couple of years. However, unlike PDX, they have made the airport connection a first priority.

A light rail connection from Seatac to downtown Seattle would be huge, especially considering how far Seatac seems from Seattle (and how awful I-5 traffic usually is). I'll bet it would be filled to capacity the first week it is in operation.

I use MAX (to the airport, too - although the old #12 bus to PDX worked fine for me before Airport MAX was done). I mean, Metro has spent billions on this thing. It's far from awful and I might as well use it. But it's a travesty that 1) there is no provision for express trains (no way for one train to pass another, practically), 2) MAX trains are limited to 2 cars, the size of a Portland city block, and 3) it stops every other block downtown. This slows MAX down needlessly and limits future expansion possibilities.

Some vision in the original design might have made the section from Rose Quarter to Goose Hollow a streetcar (like the current Portland Streetcar) and had only one or two stops at most downtown. Instead, the planners wanted a cute trolly that would be all above ground, not some scary subway I guess - but in effect, MAX *is* a streetcar when its downtown. Travel time and future expansion seem to have been the last on the list of priorities for MAX.

It's amazing that the Metro planners of MAX supposedly went to European cities to see how their transit worked, as part of figuring out what Portland needed, and this is what they came up with. The great European cities have both excellent subway systems *and* streetcars. By comparison, MAX is a joke.

Andrew

A year ago I was in Vienna and you're right Andrew the U-Bohn is the best way to get around.

Within Vienna they have a separate train that runs throughout the downtown core area that is affectionately called "The Ring." It literally is a train that goes in a circle around downtown Vienna that makes more frequent stops and really allows you to experience the hub of the city in an easy way.

Yeah, I was in Vienna around the same time you were, Chris. I rode the U-Bahn, the S-Bahn (suburban rail), and the trams (there are two trams that go around the Ring of which you speak). I did Prague, Budapest, and London on the same trip and got to experience all of their public transit systems, too. Vienna's was probably the most extensive (and complicated - at the train station coming in I got very confused about which one to take toward my hotel!). Prague's system of trams is rather extensive, plus they have buses and a simple subway system, too! The Paris Metro, while a bit dirty in places, is also the most quaint and charming of all the European subways I've been on.

I always enjoy riding the trains in European cities, which is why it's always a letdown to come back to MAX.

Andrew