If elected, what do you expect your Democrat President nominee to do about it that is significantly different? Hand-wringers need not weigh in.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/ae2d5d24-badd-11db-bbf3-0000779e2340.html

Herb

State first what YOU would have a president do. I mean, now that Bush has let this happen on his watch, presumably you mean do something different than Bush's failed policy, right?

Andrew

Hey, it's easy being a critic. Let's hear some answers that are better. Or don't you have any?

Herb

North Korea has nukes.

Pakistan has nukes.

China has nukes.

Russia has nukes.

"Nukes don't kill people, people kill people."

The solution to the problem is to quell the anger that Iran and the entire Middle East has toward the West, and America in particular. If the Iranian leadership is itching to attack us, then Kim Jong Il must be frothing at the mouth. I have asked before, and will ask again, why aren't we stacking our troops up in the DMZ and preparing to go after Kim, if we really want to avoid a nuclear attack?

I answer: Oil.

If you wish to shoot fish in a barrel, it helps to make the barrel out of something that holds water.

The succession of threads you're posting recently where you obviously fancy yourself as "putting the screws" to the filthy libbies or whatever have got to be the most flimsy, loosely bound barrels ever constructed.

It also helps to fill the barrel with WATER, and not a strange combination of piss and bile.

you couldn't stack the deck with detailed instructions and a pallet jack.

Is this going to be launched by catapult? Or is it the small one that you tie to a goose? Seems like such a waste of good curry.

In all seriousness, Herb, this is a worldwide problem and demands a worldwide solution. Since the EU brought it up, I would carefully consider what they had to say before acting unilaterally. After the EU said their piece, I would hear from Iran's neighbors in the region. I would also be curious about the things that India, China and Russia had to say. Of course, this would also be a matter for the United Nations and NATO. After hearing them out, I would weigh in with America's needs. Then, as a planet, or realistically, the nations with power, money and bigger guns, we would act in the best interest of the world. We might even all come together and talk to Iran, like a mamby-pamby after-school special about a drug intervention. Scary thought, eh? The whole damn world, Herb, collectively deciding their own fate.

I bet my plan would work.

Yet another thread from Herb to push how bad Bush is?

Herb, it's not up to US to come up with a better plan. It's up to BUSH. Let's hear a better plan from HIM.

I think Herb keeps asking for us to come up with a better plan because he knows his team can't find one. So now he looks to us.

Herb - do you think Bush's " plan " is a good one? Are you defending it as a good one? I don't even know what Bush's plan IS. Do you? What is he going to do exactly?

"What is he going to do exactly?"

Leave it for the next guy.

OK - fine. That's a good point. Here's what I would do, Herb. And you can apply this to just about everything he touches;

I would take away all his " decider " powers and make him sit in a fuckin' corner until he is out. Then yes, PLEASE let the next guy handle it. Let him/her fix it all. Because Bush can't do one thing right. he's making it ALL worse. EVERYTHING.

So there you go. Send him out to clear some brush and catch a bass. Put him out to pasture. I don't care who makes the decisions anymore for the next two years. Just make HIM STOP! And tell the rest of the world too. " Look World, our leader is an absolute idiot. We know it. We're sorry that it got to this point. We're going to let someone else do it now."

I think it's a pretty good plan.

Chicken- Having been overseas last year and having a brother who has lived overseas for many years, the rest of the world knows Bush is an idiot. No secret there.

Well if I was overseas I would wonder why we continue to let someone so inept continue to make important decisions.

Heck, I'm stateside and I wonder why we still do it. We keep thinking " Maybe the 20K surge is a way for him to decalre ' well, we tried. We're outta here now.' " But he never does the one thing we hope. He fails at everything he touches.

Someone needs to get that kid to stop touching shit!

Herb, it's bad form to ask a question an opinion of others without first providing one yourself. I'll be happy to provide mine once you provide yours.

Andrew

"...why aren't we stacking our troops up in the DMZ and preparing to go after Kim, if we really want to avoid a nuclear attack? I answer: Oil."

Wrong answer. It's because of China.

And you guys quit yer bellyaching. You have a chance to weigh in and tell us how much smarter you are than a Yale & Harvard graduate, who was a fighter pilot, pro baseball team part-owner, Texas governor and twice-elected president of the United States.

Herb

DUHbya is going to leave his crap for the next person because he doesn't give a shit!

You're right herb. Bush is great. My bad.

Could you imagine the looks you would get with a bumper sticker that says " Bush is doing a GREAT job! "?

Your car would get torched. Unless you were in Texas.....

I'm a Texan.

The shrub is a Yankee.

I don't hold it against him.

My brother is a Yankee too.

Please, remember the Texas of Ann Richards.

It keeps me from being angry at a place where I learned to eat, poop and cry.

I was only there six months.

The shrub was there a whole helluva lot longer and he only learned to do the same three things.

"he only learned to do the same three things."

WRONG! Shrub never got potty trained. He continues to poop on everything he touches -- from failing various business adventures and flunking out of flight school to today's iraq mess.

Thank God the world mostly knows its BUSH, not Americans themselves, who is responsible for the poop splattered all over the whole planet from this hemisphere.

I hope the next GOP president is bland and POTTY TRAINED, like George HW Bush.

Big shrub can't keep his lunch down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnOnDatqENo

Colic runs in the family.

Herb sez: And you guys quit yer bellyaching. You have a chance to weigh in and tell us how much smarter you are than a Yale & Harvard graduate, who was a fighter pilot, pro baseball team part-owner, Texas governor and twice-elected president of the United States.

Impressive!

BTW: We've always had that chance and have taken it liberally here on a regular basis. This is no different.

Or is it?

Gonna listen this time, as opposed to all the other times doing what exactly?

Seriously Herb, he's lame. Most everybody knows it. A whole lot of them will admit it now too. That just doesn't happen unless there is something seriously wrong.

If the Resident were actually a solid President, you would be able to tell us how good he really is right? Surely something would have stuck over the years. Something might have clicked and we would all be thinking, "Man, Herb has it spot on! Never thought of it like that, maybe the Shrub is decent after all."

That hasn't happened, but you know what has?

Plenty of people have come through here and said, "I regret my 2004 vote. If I had only known..."

We've had people here change parties, and found a fair number of people all wanting to lean conservative on a bunch of issues, all struggling with the GOP in it's present state.

That's telling Herb, real telling.

You're it man! Last of the last. For the entire Residency, you've been posting messages of gloom and doom. Reminding us that we will all soon learn whatever hard lesson seemed to apply that day.

Those days never came.

You have been saying it will get better, just you wait and see!

Those days never came --and things are worse!

Right before the election, you made a point of saying that "Leftists can't win elections." over and over and over.

Then your team took it in the sack.

Hard.


Gotta give you credit! You are staunch, consistant and crafty. You are here every day getting it done for the Resident who would be President if he could only get past his ego.

I respect that, seriously I do. That's solid and it's often not easy. As of late, it's been downright tough. Can't blame the folks here though. There is just too damn much material!

Herb is right.

He was part owner of the Texas Rangers.

While he was part owner, some of the most notorious, but unproven abusers of steroids were on the roster.

Among the allegedly chemically enhanced stars was one, Rafael Palmeiro, who seems to have trouble being honest with Congress too.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/01/AR2005080100739. html

This shrub has the Midas touch.

"Bush Backs Rove, Palmeiro, Intelligent Design"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/blog/2005/08/02/BL2005080201070_pf.html

How could I possibly pass a headline like that up?

A Trifecta.

Herb writes:
And you guys quit yer bellyaching. You have a chance to weigh in and tell us how much smarter you are than a Yale & Harvard graduate, who was a fighter pilot, pro baseball team part-owner, Texas governor and twice-elected president of the United States.

What are the chances Bush the Slower would have achieved even one of these had his father not been a Republican Big Shot then VP and President of the United States? I'd say: zero.

Andrew

Since the Democrats claim to have all the answers to everything, I say leave it for the next administration.

You're absolutely right, Deane.

I'm waiting for these know-it-alls to actually do something more than talk.

Herb

"And you guys quit yer bellyaching. You have a chance to weigh in and tell us how much smarter you are than a Yale & Harvard graduate, who was a fighter pilot, pro baseball team part-owner, Texas governor and twice-elected president of the United States."

Wow, you're over the top this time Herb.

My dog is smarter than this Yale graduate whom finished near the bottom of his class (whom, may I remind you, went AWOL as a NATIONAL GUARD fighter pilot, and in fact in order to avoid being sent to Vietnam had it arranged by his father to switch squadrons to another state). His stint as the Rangers owner was less than stellar - hell, he's the one that traded Sammy Sosa to the Cubs for pretty much nothing.

It isn't about the "smarts". It's common freakin' sense Herb, and this man has NONE. ZERO. ZIP. ZILCH. He got elected governor of Texas with the backing of the Bush political machine, and remember George H.W. Bush STILL walks on water as far as Texans are concerned.

I don't think the Democrats have the answer to "everything" Deane, but my God they have more answers than Bush does!

"..went AWOL as a NATIONAL GUARD fighter pilot.."

"..in order to avoid being sent to Vietnam had it arranged by his father to switch squadrons to another state.."

Pure bologna, and you know it. That you won't let go of repeated failures by your candidates Kerry and Gore against the guy speaks volumes.

It's clearly not about Mr. Bush's credentials or his performance. It's obviously about the left's insane hatred toward our president. So much that the left is emboldening our enemies.

You have no facts. Yet leftists lose it when one over-arching fact is mentioned: Mr. Clinton was so corrupt as to have been impeached and lost his license to practice law!

Herb

As an independent who has worked on a retired fighter or two, let me clarify something. The jets he flew were fighters. You are not ever a "fighter pilot" unless you have seen action. He was a "jet pilot." Most Air Force men would agree. A Tom Cruise Navy recruiting film full of embarrassing continuity errors and belly laughs that would have led to court martial is not a good guide.

The Herbiewalker shrub is the only former President who still gets a daily CIA briefing, ever. How he can get that much information and not feed it to his deficient offspring is beyond me. Even birds of prey manage to get a meal into their kids when their kids cannot hunt for themselves.

I like you Herb. I've said it before and I will probably say it again. If you had known me 10 years ago, you would have been delighted at the shots I took at Clinton. I still call out the moronic on the Democratic side and still acknowledge the best of the Republicans. I don't look in the field for the color of the cattle, just how deep the b*llsh*t is beneath their feet.

Nobody has all the answers and that is why I love America. We can have a debate, come up with solutions (or laughs) as a team and at the end of the day, stay in charge of our own destiny. The Constitution and the checks and balances make us all better people because one point of view cannot last forever. Democracy is the greatest!

I only hope our leaders take the threat that started this thread seriously. We all want freedom from a nuclear attack, for our country and our world. If we are the only ones talking about it, shame on Washington, both sides of the aisle, every last damn one of them.

WTF, people, let's focus. The next president will have few choices here. McCain, Giuliani, Romney, Brownback, Clinton, Edwards, Obama, Richardson, whoever will have to:
1) Re-build our military and use it sensibly again;
2) Start using tough, strategic diplomacy again (as all presidents did before 2001) to maintain our interests; and
3) Work with other countries. That doesn't mean letting the UN rule things, it means getting our way through strength (and not just military strength).

So Iran's gonna get the bomb? What are we doing to marshall the self-interest of other countries in that part of the world? What are we doing to de-stabilize Iran's president, who is on very shaky politically ground these days? What are we doing with our military to show our strength without actually killing American boys and girls?

Hmmm, we're not doing ANY of those? Maybe the CURRENT president ought to start there. Maybe he should start showing some personal responsibility for the problems he's helped create.

And maybe the Dems in congress should stop letting Bush set the agenda by arguing about a troop surge, and start saying they're the only thing protecting the country from Bush's lies and arrogance.

(failures) We do this about once every two weeks: Selected, not elected the first time; the second time was under a cloud of doubt, with election fraud cases working their way through the court right now.

Let's go through it one more time huh?

-It's clearly not about Mr. Bush's credentials or -his performance.

For the record, it is his credentials and it is his dismal performance that is the issue. In fact, all of the serious issues we face are currenly being mangled by this guy. He really sucks hard Herb --and Deane.

Have some support for 'clearly'? I'm very interested in hearing that, because the words written here do not align with 'clearly'.


-It's obviously about the left's insane hatred -toward our president.

Do you have some support for that, or are you just confusing disregard and hate again? Nobody hates Bush --well maybe some people do, but nobody here does.

This translates to: "I just don't get why they don't like the guy." Don't say we didn't try to explain it to you, over and over.

And insane now? So we are with you, or insane? Nice new lexicon Herb. Ham fist and friends are getting a bit worn, probably wise to rotate in some new bits from time to time. Wouldn't want the tried and true to wear too thin.

-So much that the left is emboldening our enemies.

Oh yeah, war time, with no declaration of war, supported by false justification and an incomplete authorization. There is a strong case for his incompetence emblodening our enemies too.

And who is this left? I know righties, middles and lefties who all would support what I wrote above. Really this translates to: "Bush supporters and everybody else. With us, or lefties."

The most loyal Texas Bush supporters I know, won't dare to say they still love the guy Herb. The facts are in, keep coming, and do not support your position. They know better. For what it's worth, they still really love the guy, but know they do more harm to the GOP than good by engaging in open advocacy right now.


-You have no facts.

Assloads of them, with more coming, all presented here for discussion. The guy sucks green donkey dicks and that's undisputed Herb.


-Yet leftists lose it when one over-arching fact -is mentioned: Mr. Clinton was so corrupt as to -have been impeached and lost his license to -practice law!

Yep, he got a BJ and lied about it. That lie harmed us in that it set the stage for your crowd to leverage it into a Residency. He's an ass for that and everybody knows it.

Nobody loses it, until you combine that statement with complete and total willfull ignorance about the Resident and his corrupt friends at the GOP starting an unjust war, no bid contracts to companies they have interests in, votes for sale, gay molestors, rip off play both side lobbyiests, jailed majority leader for corruption (he's smiled in his mug shot Herb), all supported by twisted interpetations of the Constution for their gain, not ours. Like you say, you just can't make this stuff up!

By comparison, your average joe would declare Bill Clinton to be more or less squeaky clean.

I suppose that's enough for the morning. I probably should just ignore this stuff, but I just can't. It's a load of complete and total BS that you dump here on a fairly regular basis. As always it's just hammered, panckake flat, swept up and tossed for the crap it is.

One of these days, you are either gonna come to some level of acceptance on these things, grow tired as you did before and retreat, or it will reach a point where it does not matter.

But I personally am not giving you one ounce of ground on it, until you can actually support it.


Think hard about that. Door is open --sell me! Tell me how great of a Resident this guy is. Once again, it should not be hard right? If we are all just haters, debunking that should be cake with extra frosting.

Where is it then?

"And maybe the Dems in congress should stop letting Bush set the agenda by arguing about a troop surge, and start saying they're the only thing protecting the country from Bush's lies and arrogance."

Good on you for saying that!

I'm dissappointed in the Dems right now too. They've got plenty of leverage to make this really messy to the point where something will change. That's what they were elected for, let's see some action.

I pick number two as the most viable short term effort that can do some good, followed by aggressive efforts at number one (that will take some time though.)

Two and three are actually related, IMHO in that we have no real strength, unless we can convince others to help us in this regard.

Frankly, none of it's gonna matter until we demonstrate some acceptance of the situation now. The next guy is gonna have to do that and it's not gonna look pretty. That fact alone is a solid justification for either an Indie or Dem president.

The GOP as a party needs to cycle out some key people before it is capable of doing the right thing.

"Dems in congress should stop letting Bush set the agenda by arguing about a troop surge, and start saying they're the only thing protecting the country from Bush's lies and arrogance."

Sutton, this is one of the best ideas I have heard yet. The Democrats control Congress, but it would also include an ever growing number of Republicans who still believe in the Constitution and want to save the party. Like I said earlier about McCain, sometimes you have to cut off the arm to save the body.

This system is set up in three autonomous, yet cooperative branches of government. It is wonderful, but can sometimes be too simple for our leaders. We all still remember tag or hide and seek. They killed their inner children to get power, so they can be dense sometimes, but mebbe their own kids will suggest it.

The courts are the tree and the shrub administration has been hiding behind the tree. Round and round and round and round this group of legislators go. Out of breath, nauseous, angry, frustrated and still they make circles. For longer than it took for us to win World War Two, longer than it took for us to fire a man into space and longer than it took for Gorbachev to free his people once he gained power.

The tree is not going to move, maybe a little in a very strong wind, but it is old and sturdy. Congress needs to stop, take a breath, think about what they are going to do and catch the fellas when they come flying around the back side of the tree. As a nation of constituents, we all had this mind blowing childhood catharsis. Why the hell it has yet to occur to them, is a whole new question.

Littlesongs-I like you, too. You're one of the more balanced posters on this board, way more than most liberals and more than I am.

Herb

Thank you Herb.

I might like the kickers best in the long run, but I will readily admit, it is much more fun to watch the backs and receivers trying to advance and score. That is the biggest part of the game. It is a great country when everybody has a chance to toss and run the ball around. This group here knows their pigskin.

"Pure bologna, and you know it. That you won't let go of repeated failures by your candidates Kerry and Gore against the guy speaks volumes.

It's clearly not about Mr. Bush's credentials or his performance. It's obviously about the left's insane hatred toward our president. So much that the left is emboldening our enemies.

You have no facts. Yet leftists lose it when one over-arching fact is mentioned: Mr. Clinton was so corrupt as to have been impeached and lost his license to practice law!"

Explain why then the Pentagon has declassified documents stating these EXACT THINGS then. So I guess the Pentagon is lying?

"You're absolutely right, Deane.

I'm waiting for these know-it-alls to actually do something more than talk."

And I am still waiting for you to say what YOU would do! ALL of us are!