I'll give you a win..win..win!

You said:

"Author: Waynes_world
Tuesday, December 05, 2006 - 3:41 pm


Thanks Herb for your kind words and thats what I will respond to. I won't trust those others with an apology with a 10 foot pole. The reason is they don't know how to forgive!"

You tell Skep you are sorry and you were wrong and I promise not one condasending word in regards to that.

http://feedback.pdxradio.com/show.cgi?tpc=2186&post=160327#POST160327



Plus I will apologize to you for all of the rotten and mean things I said about you. As a metter of fact the old Muck man may just slip back into the shadow's and once again become a quiet spectator. I think that will actually find that you can trust us with something shorter than a ten foot pole. We are not out to prove any one person wrong all of the time....just want them to own up when they are not exactly correct......you know a little give and take. Anyway furthest I ever got was Cub Scouts....so Cub Scouts honor I will not say one thing about it if you do this. I am sure others will not either...but some may but just pay no mind to them.

Ball is in your court man...take it and run with it.

You are quite forgiven I assure you and if I said anything that offended you I am sorry. I think we have actually agreed on a number of occasions and that surprized me. Its Christmas you know and we should be full of joy and good will. I am getting a bit tired of the spin are you? We should make this a no spin zone a la Bill O'Reilly.

You tell Skep you are sorry and you were wrong and I promise not one condasending word in regards to that.

http://feedback.pdxradio.com/show.cgi?tpc=2186&post=160327#POST160327

Cmon.....make piece in here.....it won't kill ya and I doubt others will ridicuel you for it......would make a ton of difference!!!

I think he needs to aplogize to me for the insults that he has dealt toward me. I can't do anything until that has been addressed. To me his insults hurt as much as swearing does.

But skep says never has swore at you in a post!

I know that but he has insulted me too much and until he backs down I can't do anything.

"I can't do anything until that has been addressed."

"he has insulted me too much and until he backs down I can't do anything."


"Can't"???

You mean "won't".

You always have an excuse, huh, Wayne?

Quick! Somebody call the Waaaaambulance...severe hurt feelings and inability to turn other cheek symptons reported.

Like MY mommy says "if you're going to dish it out, you better be able to...blah blah blah."

Geez, I never once was called a "commie" by the troll, right??? NOT!!

Wayne, you lied. I want to know WHY you lied.

Wayne,I've been right here to defend you and everyone elses right to speak right or wrong.In this case you've been nailed.Take your lumps, apologize to Skep and move forward.As a Christian you and I both know we don't give forgiveness with terms.Our Father doesn't do it that way for us nor should we.You may deserve an apology for things said to you by Skep and others(truly many on this board need to take a good hard look at themselves)but what Skep is talking about in this instance he has asked numerous times and politely I might add.Plant the seed and see what grows.

Nothing to lose and everything to gain!

Author: Average_joe
Wednesday, December 06, 2006 - 11:21 am


Wayne,I've been right here to defend you and everyone elses right to speak right or wrong.In this case you've been nailed.Take your lumps, apologize to Skep and move forward.As a Christian you and I both know we don't give forgiveness with terms.Our Father doesn't do it that way for us nor should we.You may deserve an apology for things said to you by Skep and others(truly many on this board need to take a good hard look at themselves)but what Skep is talking about in this instance he has asked numerous times and politely I might add.Plant the seed and see what grows.

-----
I have never seen you defend me once. Where have you done that at all? You have been negative in just about everything you have said to me or about me. Why are you forcing me to do Skeps bidding? I thought you were against forcing! The fact is it would do no good to apologize to him because he won't forgive. He will do nothing but insult me some more just like he always has done. Why should I trust him with that?

It's ok Wayne. Don't do it. We ( well, I ) don't really care and we're ( well, me ) not surpried that you won't.

But I tell ya, you did miss a good chance to show us that we were wrong about you. But, nope. We ( well, me ) weren't.

Big deal. I won't judge you for that when you offer SO much more to be judged for.

Hallelujah Brother......

Faith I say...Faith I Say....FAITH I SAY...Will set you FREE.....

The LORD SAYETH judge not lest you be judged.....

Amen...And the GOOD BOOK Says......DO UNTO OTHERS AS YE WOULD HAVEDUN UNTO YOU.....

Hallelujah and priase GOD....GOD IS GREAT.....

AMEN>>>AMEN>>>AMEN>>>>>


Go forth child and praise the LORD In all his DIVINE GOODNESS.......PASS ON THAT GOODNESS TO YOUR FELLOW MAN.....To Forgive is Divine.....

OHHH YAAHH....AMENNNN

HALLELUJAH....HALLELUJAH........

Wow,Now I'm starting to understand everyone here more clear.Because in fact in the "I've heard enough" thread, I mentioned that when they all wanted your head on a platter,that they needed to back off and ignore you if they didn't like what you said.I've even re-read the 3 times I have wrote about you and I look like freakin Switzerland.I have defended yours and everyone elses right to post collectively(that does include you).I'm not forcing you do do anything.People have burned me through out my life and it sucks.They did the same to Jesus but He kept forgiving.You don't have to go out to dinner with anyone here or socialize at all with them but you know as well as I do we have to forgive.How many times have you sinned and God forgave you?Everytime you asked!It's not for you to decide if Skep will accept your apology,It doesn't even matter if he does today or ever.Your a man of faith as I,It is our job to do what is right and leave the rest to God.Where is your faith in his powers to change people.If Skep or anyone here insults you,ignore them,who cares.You do what you want.I'm suggesting have some faith and plant a seed.Remember if you sow sparingly you will reap the same.Wayne,I have NOTHING against you or anyone on this board so I'm not sure where the negativity came from but if it was a mistake or whatever you want to call it,I forgive you.And to anyone out there if I'm missing something(I mean,not understanding)please tell me,I'm big enough to admit when I'm wrong.

I appreciate that and I don't dislike you at all personally. But the insults are pretty hard to ignore if the insulter is demanding that I apologize. If only he would agree to back off I might consider. But I don't see how that could happen. An insult is just as bad as a swear word. I don't care if he swore at me or not. Calling someone an idiot is not being very respectful. If you have told people to back off I appreciate that a lot. I consider myself a forgiving person. But I guess I am getting a bit tired of people walking all over me. I would be more than willing to apologize but there has to be a willingness to forgive. What good is any apology if people will just use it to jump over me? Thats what I am afraid Skep will do. Some people are just determined to hold grudges

WW said>>>
I know that but he has insulted me too much and until he backs down I can't do anything.

WHAT???

WW needs to read this aloud to himself...

apparently not even james baker III and lee hamilton are going to be able to save this one.

joe. don't feel bad about being freaking switzerland . . . a number of people who regularly don't come to this side of the forum have come before you and failed as well and made virtually the same parting comments.

Sad, eh?

Thanks Skep and yes it is.
Wayne,read my post again.It doesn't matter what anyone else does.We have to step up and do the right thing even if everyone else does the wrong thing.I rather be ridiculed for doing what is right than standing tall on the wrong side.So what if you apologize,you might lose face.I doubt it.None of us are near as cool as we think we are anyway.Plant a seed!

You think the big guy puts conditions on his forgiveness of you as someone else wisely said in another thread? No Way! Big deal if you don't get one in response....at least you tried and in the end that is all you can do. Also Skep has never said there would not be forgiveness. Again...what have you to lose? nothing! Nothing ventured nothing gained. If you want peace you gotta learn to turn the other cheek! Big dang deal if you don't get an apology in return.......

Pride is a sinful thing! We all have it! Once in a while we all have to take the first step in a situation we do not like and sometimes we trip but in the end are better for having done so.

Once again...you have nothing to lose and everything to gain for yourself and the only thing I see stopping you is ....well I just don't know what it is but I would have apologized long ago and tried to move on. Part of me thinks you refuse to do this so you can keep on ranting about this issue. Well I am pretty much fed up with this and will not give in to insults anymore but if you cannot do this I will no longer take part in any of these type of discussions. I can agree with you on some points and others I do not but this whole thing can be put to an end when one person takes the first step and does so.

Get over it and move one....regardless the reply...you can say you did it and tried.

Wayne, you lied when you stated that I swore in a post to you. Please explain why you lied.

Is this what you mean when you say: "don't confuse me with facts, my mind is made up?"

Should people who lie (legal term called libel) about other forum members be cause for dismissal from the forum?

Please explain to me why you had to lie about me in this forum.

Why should YOU, someone who LIES be allowed to post here? Should we report you to Dan?

Why LIE Wayne?

I'm waiting.

It was bad intelligence.

Wayne, why did you lie?

Maybe he's a natural born liar. Just like Lars.

Wayne lies because he has NOTHING factual to talk about. He is spoon fed all his quotes from FAUXNews, Plush LimBLAH, Insannity and the rest of the EXTREME REICH nut cases on neo-CON radio stations across this great nation they are destroying on hour at a time....

Wayne and Herb are the same person! Newsflash! More at 11.

Wayne and Herb are the same person????
DD's is Wayne and Herb???
Trixter is Reficul???
OMG!
What is this board coming to???

Oh, I think I started that rumor that Wayne and Herb are the same person. Can't say for sure, BUT I notice once again when you catch them tripping all over their own tongues like Skeptical is saying, they are nowhere to be found.

I don't think they are the same person. It would take too much talent for someone to act as dumb as Wayne is naturally.

Naw, I don't think Herb is Wayne. Wayne has been around here for a long time and it would be hard to believe Herb would be biding his time all these years just so he could surface now and create this chaoctic character.


WAYNE, WHY DID YOU LIE ABOUT ME?

Let's all say a prayer to God that Wayne comes to his senses and learns to accept facts. We may be pushing him to much and I fear me may "go postal," given his past employment.

Hey, while you're at it, put in a word for the Herbster, too.

I'm not ashamed to admit that I can use all the help I can get.

Herbert M.

Hopefully you'll have better results than the heart surgery patients did.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/04/060403133554.htm

Wayne needs it more, but I have enough respect for both of you to put in a good word for you Herb.

I need all of the prayer I can get, but I didn't think you ever prayed, Pete!

He can still believe in GOD even though he does not agree with you Wayne. It is OK to disagree to agree....wait....got that ass backwards....its ok to agree to disagree.

See my last post in the "NEWS FLASH" thread......

The point is agreement. Thats the point of the thread at all. Its definately NOT okay to disagree with Pete. He is praying for my blind agreement. Thats not happening. I think it would be easier to pray that God's willl be done. He isn't that impressed with our political outlook as much as he is with our faith.

Well, at least Herb and I can both enjoy listening to KLYC.

Apologies to Alfredo, but getting back on topic:

I pray for Wayne to stop posting here. (By choice or otherwise.)

I pray for you guys to stop responding to him.

I pray for strength to do the same.

Amen.

...and the congregation said...

"Amen"

I pray for politeness and civility. I pray for an end to insults, personally attacks
and name calling.

"Well, at least Herb and I can both enjoy listening to KLYC."

Man, Eve was sounding GREAT today.

Herbert Hoover

Author: Digitaldextor
Friday, December 01, 2006 - 8:29 pm


I pray for politeness and civility. I pray for an end to insults, personally attacks
and name calling.

----
What a wonderful idea. I will be praying for the same thing. Maybe God will hear that one!

WW if you want then why do you insult???
You insult Liberals all the time when they are simply HUMAN BEINGS!

Insult:Disagreement, they are the same thing, Trix. You can't expect the whole world to be a liberal like yourself.

You think that disagreement and insults are the same thing Wayne?

Yes or no.

WW said>>>
You can't expect the whole world to be a liberal like yourself.

WTF??? I guess YOU can't expect the WHOLE world to be NAZI like you....

I said I was Liberal when?? You truly are the most ignorant person on God's green earth....

Don't deny it, Trix. You are a liberal who hates America. You are so much of a liberal you don't want to admit it.

Author: Chickenjuggler
Saturday, December 02, 2006 - 8:03 pm


You think that disagreement and insults are the same thing Wayne?

Yes or no.

--
I don't but you and Trix both think they are the same thing. The whole world is supposed to have the exact same outlook on life that you and Trix have. You blame me for preaching but thats what you and he are doing.

Wayner the complainer said>>>
Don't deny it, Trix. You are a liberal who hates America. You are so much of a liberal you don't want to admit it.

THANKS for the INSULT..

HYPOCRITE!

Why am I a hypocrite? You are so much of a liberal you won't admit it. Why is it such a bad thing to be a liberal? I never said it was. Being a conservative is the big sin according to the liberals here.

Wayner the complainer said>>>
You are so much of a liberal you won't admit it.

HUH? WTF?
NOBODY and I repeat NOBODY has said it's a sin to be a fascist ultra right wing neo-CONer. NOBODY!
We just don't want to think as you! I'm a TRUE Republican that can think on his own. Do I side with Libs? NOPE! But when you RAM the Bible and your ideological thinking down everyone's throat it's disturbing. Your HARDLINE approach makes me sad as a Republican......
Just because I don't think as you I'm NOT a Republican? Ridiculous!

I think maybe you could use some of the truth from the Bible. Maybe it just might change your life.
I get the feeling you are just saying you are a Republican. Who was the last Republican you voted for? Are you for anything the Republicans are for? Like tax breaks? Like conservative judges? How about pro life? Do you support the second ammendment?

Author: Chickenjuggler
Saturday, December 02, 2006 - 8:03 pm


You think that disagreement and insults are the same thing Wayne?

Yes or no.

--
Wayne answered - "I don't..."

OK. There it is folks. A real-life answer to a question. The way your statement read, I thought maybe you did think they were the same. So I asked for clarification and got it. What Wayne said after " I don't..." happens to be incorrect - but that doesn't matter to me. What matters is that I asked a question and got an answer.

That means a lot Wayne. Honestly. And someone may have prayed for me as I woke up feeling like I have no more anger in me to express to or about Wayne.

Who knows? Maybe hashing out things like this will make things better for some. I know it did me.

Wayne, thanks. We disagree on just about everything - but I can handle that now. I don't know why I couldn't before - but I can now.

Word to your mother.

I am so glad you don't feel anger today. That means a lot to me. I have been praying about that and I think I got an answer. I am glad that we can disagree and be gentlemanly about it.

WW said>>>
I think maybe you could use some of the truth from the Bible.

Take some of your own advice....

Trixter, you're just being mean.

Give it a rest, or else then stop blaming others with whom you disagree.

Herb

Same goes for you Herb...

Take YOUR own advice.....

I'm not swearing.
I'm not calling others nazis.

Blame and deny.

Classic reaction when you have no argument.

Herb

So you have NO argument then...

Goodbye!

Fat chance. You won't say goodbye. I wish you would.

INSULTS wont make me leave!

Skinny chance.....

Trixter, you've been saying a lot of angry things.

Why not leave personalities out of it?

Herb

Try taking some of your own advice for once.....

Author: Herb
Sunday, December 03, 2006 - 8:37 pm


Trixter, you've been saying a lot of angry things.

Why not leave personalities out of it?

Herb

-------
Herb you may be asking too much. Personality is all that Trix cares about.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-stein28nov28,0,4071327.column?coll=la- opinion-columnists

Oh, absolutely!

what does she look like?

You.

You mean, what does HE look like.

Insannity is gay???

May he burn in hell with the rest of the homosexuals.....

Wonder when LimBLAH is coming out of the closet?

LOL@ Mrs M!

Let's call him Pastor Wayne.

After a lot of very difficult conversation, it comes down to Wayne being here simply because he believes we all need to see god in the same way he does.

This is a one way conversation. Essentially, he will always engage, never consider others, and preach, preach, preach until he drops.

This is an abuse of this forum. If he wants to get the word out full time, then he can step up and pay for that. I see no reason why all of us need to.

This is not pulpit for any of us to abuse, in that we all can step up and get after it, but also must step down as others take their turn. Failure to do this is an abuse.

To be clear, this is not about religion, or Wayne's religion in particular. It is about proper use of this resource. Imagine somebody, preaching in the street non stop! Nobody wants this, there are laws against this.

This is essentially what is happening.

It is time for Wayne to step down for a while.

Randy is right. I'll not be contributing again, until Wayne steps down.

As in Radio, the public can always 'turn the dial' or simply choose not to respond.

At least that's what liberals typically say when conservatives voice concerns about controversial topics.

Herb

This is different.

In the case of radio broadcasting being done in the way that Wayne is doing here, those doing the broadcasting have done what is required of them to pay their way.

They pay for the speech and are publishing it with their own means. The spectrum they use is public, and they have a right to some of it. This is exactly as it should be, and I strongly support their right to do this.

If Wayne were to pay for a venue in this way, he would be completely within his rights to preach all day long.

This has implications where changing the channel is concerned.

a. nobody here has any entitlement of free speech in that:
-we all asked permission to post
-none of us own the venue
-contributions are asked to help support the venue

b. the value of this venue is a direct function of it's contributors
-we provide content we choose to enjoy or not
-each makes the decision to contribute or not
-we all have a mutual stake in the value here.

Thus, there are no channels to choose from. This forum is unique, because of the people in it. If any of us choose to change the channel, we forego the others here which is where the value is.

Though the Internet is public, this venue in particular is not. None of us own it, and we are required (well not required as a mandate, but as a courtesy) to contribute with both our content and our dollars.

Again, what Wayne is doing (and you are not BTW) is theft. He has essentially said he's going to force us to listen to him because he knows we all value our time here. That's just poor behavior on so many fronts, I cannot even begin.

Let's reconsider this in physical terms. While not perfect, the analogy I'm going to put here is enough to get the point across:

Let's say we all live in a nice little neighborhood. We are close enough that we share a commons of sorts. Maybe this commons is like a part, or shared area of ground where all of us pay to have maintained, but nobody owns.

Each of us is free to use the commons for our own purpose, or for shared purposes, but none are allowed to dominate the commons without the mutual consent of all.

One member of our little community finds god and spends all his time in the commons preaching to the other members of the community so described above.

No matter the activity in the commons, we have this person reminding us about god non stop.

When asked to refrain, this person claims free speech and all that, and also says they will not bow down to the others because god is just and true and whatever else fits the message of the day.

This essentially is a tragedy of the commons. We have laws in place to prevent this sort of thing from happening. Why? Because these kinds of actions are harmful to others.

In this community, each of us has made an investment in the others, thus the value lies in the mutual benefit we all derive from interacting in our commons.

So, what does changing the channel mean?

We could simply move, or choose not to come to the commons any more. However, this choice means foregoing the investments in others and our place in the community as a whole.

The Internet, embodied in places in it like this one, is not like the television. Changing the channel is like moving to another place where you no longer have access to relationships and people that were of value.

Essentially Wayne knows he has a captive audience to preach to and he's abusing this, claiming some entitlement that allows him to do so without having to be accountable for his actions.

This is wrong and anybody, who thinks through it, knows it.

So, I will move and build new relationships if I must. Before doing so, I will make my reasons why known to the others here, who have given me much value over the years. This is why I am posting here now.

But I don't really want to move. I like the people here where I am. I like this channel and the people on it. Looking around, there are not any other channels like this one. Why? Because it's the people here, not the venue (channel) that make it what it is.

Wayne is destroying that to satisfy his own needs. He has no entitlement to do this. None. It's not his views that are the issue, it is his unwillingness to refrain from dominating the commons that is.

I don't mind the religious discussion one bit. We've had many of them here. However, we've not had the topic continue to be an issue, on nearly any subject, for such a long string of time.

We have had people say they are gonna post what they want, when they want, how they want no matter what others think. These people have been banned, and or given a vacation over the years. As I recall Wayne has had one of these in the past actually. My claims here are not without merit in that regard.

Nobody here wants what Wayne is doing. Furthermore, should Wayne craft his own pulpit, I strongly doubt he would attract such an audience. So, he comes here to abuse the captive audience, essentially forced to deal with his non stop preaching because of the shared relationships and interest that all come along for the ride.

To sum up, this is not like radio at all. It's also not about any religious or political persuasion in particular.

It is about behavior, specifically we have the tragedy of the commons embodied in Waynes actions here.

The historical response to such a tragedy is regulation, or a decision to forego a commons in favor of some ownership.

The reality here is that we only have regulation as an answer as the commons we share really is owned by a benefactor who permits us to use it, provided we are willing to help maintain it.

Therefore, the only actions remaining are:

-regulation
-tolerance
-abstinence.

Only a fool tolerates ongoing abuse. A flash in the pan is different from this. Clearly the group does not favor regulation in the form of more aggressive moderation.

So, either he steps down, or I'm gonna move on. The value here is diminished with each passing day. I'm pretty much at the point where it's better to move on.

Perhaps the value of my own contributions is not worthy enough to merit greater consideration. I'm ok with that. But I must ask the group as a whole, is the value of Waynes contriubution worth the level of consideration he receives by continuing to post here?

How long will it go before more members of this online community reach the same value judgment I have? What then?

Is that worth continuing to grant Wayne consideration above and beyond that which is essential to any member here at present?

For me personally, the answer is no. It used to be a yes, then it became a maybe. I changed identities at that time to mark that point in time and serve as a reminder to seriously consider my own contributions here, so as to make this point in time reasonable where my own justification is concerned.

So there it is.

Is he worth it?

I think Wayne should be banned as a spammer.

It would also be nice if we could put users on ignore, so we don't see their text on the thread.

"Is he worth it?"

Is it worth it to spend one's time writing a lengthy treatise about someone you've never met and dislike so much?

"It would also be nice if we could put users on ignore, so we don't see their text on the thread."

What's the matter? You mean the mere existence of a thread you don't agree with bothers you that much? If that's the case, then the problem isn't with the Waynester. Otherwise, you could choose to ignore him yourself, or overcome his arguments with your superior logic.

Herb

Actually, I've met Wayne. Known him for a good long time through his actions here.

This recent change is not in character, and is abusive to all of us as a whole. It's not a thread or two, it's not political or religious, and most importantly it's not about reason. If it were, I would not have posted what I did.

eg: You Herb are a solid example. We seriously don't agree on a lotta stuff, but overall it's been just fine. You push back hard and that's good. I've learned plenty from you and will continue to do so.

Reason sorts the spats out and we've all continued just fine.

This is not happening with Wayne.

Maybe Dan has some ground rules we all can review.

Personally, I like the fact that he's a 'hands-off' kind of website owner. That helps keep debate open without squelching it. However, I'm open.

Herb

"You mean the mere existence of a thread you don't agree with bothers you that much?"

No, that's not the problem at all. On other sites/programs, one can turn on the "ignore" feature that blocks (only) you from seeing or having to waste time with, or bother reading posts made by a specific troll or spammer.


(I'll reiterate that I would prefer WW to be gone from here, by any means)

"...blocks (only) you from seeing or having to waste time with..."

That's the part I didn't get.
Who says one HAS to waste time with anyone?

It's just move on to the next thread, WITHOUT RESPONDING, if it is so offensive.

I've frequently observed the liberal position on this board that takes posters to task for NOT RESPONDING?

Seems like people on this board feel that they MUST respond or be labeled as evading a question. Tain't always so. Maybe it isn't appropriate to respond. Like when one slanders others by calling them a nazi...or worse.

Herb

It's forced then.

That's just like saying ignore the spam in your mailbox. Does that not consume time and energy, thus diminishing the value of the service?

It does for me and everybody I know.

Not responding, when at the same time trying to claim the high ground on something is completely different from having to not respond to ongoing, largely off topic BS.

Again, consider the analogy I presented above. Let's say a few of us were in our commons sharing a drink. Some guy is walking around, injecting things into the conversation, holding up signs, etc?

Sure, we could choose to not respond, but that's an active and constant effort that diminishes the value of the meeting does it not?

What's the usual reaction to these kinds of things?

In meatspace, people will call the authorities to have the person dealt with. If that fails, people move on.

Think about it.

A couple quick things.I have been reading this site for a few years now and Wayne has never bothered me ever.Not because I agree with everything he says but because if I see something I think is ridiculous I choose to ignore him.Just like I do with a lot of you.Wayne doesn't make you angry or whatever,You choose to allow yourselves to get angry...Don't tell me you can't ignore him,many of us out here do.If he leaves you with a bad taste in your mouth,STOP BITING.
As for you who say if Wayne is allowed to stay you won't contribute any more.IMO that is the same as attempting to hold Dan hostage until you get your way and that is WRONG.If I were Dan,anyone who ever threatened me like that would be banned immediatly.This is an incredible site why would you kill the body to get rid of a cancer(If that is what you believe Wanye is).Understand I'm not defending anyone and at the same time I'm defending everyone and their right to express themselves whether I agree or not.
It's been said here many times just ignore what you don't like.Now make that an action and that includes this post.
Now everyone out there,Wayne included,take a deep breath and have a great up coming week!!!

Nobody is saying kill the body for the cancer. I'd just prefer to see the cancer killed, as the body will move forward just fine.

Well, I am.

Average_joe has a good point --and a great handle!

All right. I've said my peace. I'll go on the ignore mantra and see what happens.

A counterpoint though: What if the quality of life, to continue Joe's analogy, is not worth living?

I'm sorta there... maybe it's just me.

Hello everyone....

I have decided that this forum is no longer worth my time to frequent. Not that I do not enjoy talking with most of you but one person has made it so unenjoyable that it is just not worth it. WAYNE is a hipocrit in that he incites people into angry responses and also constantly brings false witness to people by putting words in their mouths that are simply not true. If things happen to improve could someone please send me an email. Until then have a good one folks....

Yours Truly
John

Herb said>>>>
What's the matter? You mean the mere existence of a thread you don't agree with bothers you that much?

Sounds kinda like you Herb "Tricky DICK" Nixon...

Wayne is like a virus -- there is no means of controlling it. Even if everyone ignored wayne, we'd still have to wade through the thread to find the subsistance. why allow someone to deliberately disrupt a website? His religious comments alone would get him banned from most political sites. Indeed, he may be here because he is unable to get away with his nonsense elsewhere.

Close the door on the troll.


averagejoe, nobody is holding dan hostage. forum visitors and forum owners need each other, other wise, this place would just be a website. In addition, a healthy forum needs people from all spectrums of society. We have that here. But now we have a troll who is spitting on forum mebers and the forum owner.

Again, the troll needs to go.

If you can't take it anymore maybe its time for you to take a break, Skeptical. You and the other liberals want to have the forum all to yourselves. You may censor me but there are hundreds less tolerant than me waiting to take my place.

WW said>>>
You and the other liberals want to have the forum all to yourselves.

This REPUBLICAN says that's a lie

The evidence is there.

Non-conservatives here are bashing those with different beliefs. But more than that, they insist conservatives have no right to communicate here.

If you want total leftist idealogy, there are plenty of totally lib boards. It'd be easy for you there. That way, you don't have to defend the leftist view, but can bash conservatives without challenge.

If it walks, quacks and flies like a duck...

Herb

Herbert Tricky DICK said>>>
If it walks, quacks and flies like a duck...

You must be a duck then...

QUACK!
QUACK!

Actually, I'm more of a Beaver fan.

Herb

There is your FIRST problem....

QUACK
QUACK

DAMN Beavers.....

If you'd like to discuss last week's Civil War, that's fine with me.

Herb

Sure and then we will talk about last years records and last years Civil War....
That's fine with me...
And how about the 2nd longest record losing season streak in Division I football???
That's FINE with me...

"..last years records and last years Civil War...."

Sorry.

Who's going to the better bowl THIS YEAR?

Herb

Who didn't go last year??? AT ALL????

I like both schools. But how many baseball titles has Oregon won?

Great points and counterpoints.But,don't you see it.If Trixter would NOT have bit,Wayne and Herb would just be talking to themselves and we could just scroll right past or ignore the the thread completely.Don't kid yourselves if Wayne or any of us leave,we will be replaced in time for better or worse.Just like in the real world.Now what about having that great week I mentioned yesterday.

As a long timer here, I must say I agree with Average_Joe and, amazingly, Herb. I've chosen to use the ignore card a lot here lately, as I see endless back and forth about religion and beliefs, which I believe are personal choices that basically can't be argued. I'd really prefer we get away from religion completely here, unless we keep it non-personal.

I'd also like to see us get away from constantly reverting to name calling/stereotyping, like Herb constantly does with his use of "liberal", and others do with thier use of "conservative." Those should are not negative terms. They are supposed to be representative of a set of beliefs. Why everyone is focusing so much on Wayne and his religious preaching I can't understand. Let it go, ignore it, whatever. Let's get back to some semi-intelligent discussion. Or we will lose folks for sure.

joe sez: "If Trixter would NOT have bit"

Good point! But then, I'm not a republican and I've no way to rein him in . . . so if some of his GOP friends would put a muzzle on him and remove his CAPS key we'll get somewhere.

Threats of that type, even as a joke, are not cool.

You are right...I apologize for that one and have removed it. Sorry to you and Wayne and any other who did not appreciate that one.

Sorry.

It was meant only as a joke not a threat.....but it was improper...thanks for straightening me out there Randy!!

I forgive and thanks for removing it.

The edit function has saved my neck more than once.

Herb, just because you are staunch or whatever, that doesn't mean that your opinions are less valid. I don't know why I felt the need to tell you that I like having a person that is polar opposite of me around here. But there it is. I do. I thought it was ok to note that just because I disagree with YOU, Herb, doesn't mean I don't like having you around. Call it " covering my bases " or whatever you want - but it's the truth.

Wayne's opinions however, are invalid. We all know why. It drives me nuts to go back and forth and back and forth - but I'm tryin' to ignore Wayne. He sucks me in - and MAN do I bite.

So today is, what 11/14. Let's all TRY to just ignore him. I know there have been calls for this in the past - gentle and not so gentle reminders within posts to do so - I'm royally guilty of not having the constitution to ignore him.

No longer.

And Herb, this isn't meant to gloat or rub it in or whatever - but folks; If we can enjoy our temporary Democratic victory for a while, let's do it fully. Completely.Ignore Wayne.

I'm going to NOT post anything that resembles a response to any of the babble. No immature " Zzzzzzzz " like I have done. Sure, I'll read it. I'll WANT to post something. But what has ANYone EVER said ANYthing to him that changed ANYthing?

Nothing. Ever. Not once.

Maybe, if nothing else, I'm asking for help. Not to lead. Just to, you know, help. I am spiraling and spinning on something that I am ashamed to admit is bothering me MUCH more than it should. I'm wanting to hurt him. And that's not good. I'll leave altogether if that's what it takes.

Please help me stay out of prison. I'm scared of what I might do.

Mommy.

The difference between Troll Herb and Troll Wayne is that Herb knows exactly what he's doing. He's trolling and knows it. Wayne, on the other hand is TOTALLY clueless.

See, Troll Wayne sucks the intelligence right out of threads. While some of you enjoy playing tit for tat, you forget that there are others here and that behavior makes one not want to return.

Ignore Troll Wayne completely.

Herb at least has the common decency to cite sources to back up what he says. He had valid points. I don't AGREE with all of them, but he has valid points.

Wayne has YET to cite a damn thing. We ask for proof of something and he says that we're Communists, or terrorist lovers, or America haters, or what have you.

Herb is someone I feel I can banter with. While he seems to be a lot more right of center socially than I am, he doesn't have his head stuck in the sand.

Guys-thanks for the compliments, back-handed though some of them are.

But don't pile on the Waynester.

That's because, Brianl, Wayne has cited plenty. The main difference is that many of our democrat friends simply don't like his source for ultimate Truth. That's often because they don't accept the fact that there is any such thing.

Witness what Barbara Walters said about Peter Jennings at his funeral:

http://www.chronwatch.com/content/contentDisplay.asp?aid=16240

Rather than citing man's opinion, Wayne simply appeals to what many accept as a higher authority: The Bible.

Wayne's a good guy. Like any of you, he'd be missed if he wasn't here.

Herb

Care to detail what ultimate truth is and how it compares to absolute truth?

Is not the Bible simply man's opinion also?

I rarely agree with Herb or Wayne, but I respect fully their right to express their opinions here. We all missed Herb and I think we would miss Wayne if he left. Both give us something to think about.

It is and that's my point!

Herb used to trot out absolute truth around here. That was discussed a few times and it turns out most people accept the idea of absolute truth, but it does not support things in the manner Herb was using it to support.

Absolute truth is true for all people in all times and in all places.

After a month or two, we see ultimate truth debut here. I just want to know just what that means exactly.

In the context I've seen it used it's actually a relabeling of faith as truth. This is a confusion of what truth is and what conviction is. That does not add up, so I'm wondering just what does.

We've either got a definition for truth or we don't. Thus, everything is either relative or absolute. There really is no middle ground in this.

If we accept there is some truth, then it's either true or not. Again, no middle ground.

Absolute truth is really kind of silly in that we attach a special label to the word truth to differentiate it from things we think are true, but we don't know are true, but we act as if they are true.

Most of the truths we accept are this way. There are very few absolute truths. When it comes right down to it, we don't know very much for sure. 2+2 = 4 is an absolute truth. Eventually all of our bodies will die is an absolute truth, etc...

So what is ultimate truth?

Is it something more true than absolute truth? If so, I am curious as to how this is defined and what it means. Is it a clever way of saying that God is the ultimate truth?

If so, how can we have so many different sources of ultimate truth then? Are they all ultimate, or are just some of them ultimate and the others are wannabe ultimate truth?

If one uses a term and cannot define it using words whose meaning is mutually agreed upon by all, then the term is a mere label and therefore false on that basis alone.

Until we get some real meaning behind ultimate truth, it's actually false!

C'mon Herb, what's ultimate truth?

"C'mon Herb, what's ultimate truth?"

An excellent question and I don't expect you to accept what I say.

As we've seen, secularists like Barbara Walters, AND IN THE NEWS BUSINESS NO LESS, deny truth even exists! This suggests their standard for truth is fluid. For if there is no such thing as truth, what does it matter?

The very question you asked was asked 2,000 years ago. The very fact that you ask the question also suggests that you are a truth-seeker.

And if you have problems with the following, I have to admit I didn't write it. Here are just a few of the dozens of references to truth:

Pilate therefore said to him, "Are you a king then?" Jesus answered, "You say that I am a king. For this reason I have been born, and for this reason I have come into the world, that I should testify to the TRUTH. EVERYONE WHO IS OF THE TRUTH LISTENS TO MY WORD." John 18:37

Pilate said to him, "WHAT IS TRUTH?" When he had said this, he went out again to the Jews, and said to them, "I find no basis for a charge against him. John 18:38

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the TRUTH, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." John 14:6

Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the TRUTH, and the TRUTH shall make you free. (John 8:31-32)

We are hard-wired with a conscience, a kind of truth-detector. But who put that conscience there? A Creator.

Truth gives life. Lies give death.

The Truth fosters a culture of life.

It's not a coincidence that satan is also called by another name, the deceiver and father of all lies. The big lie is a culture of death: abortion, suicide, euthanasia.

Guys, this is not political. There are plenty of weasely Republicans. It's way, way beyond labels.

Herb

Everything you base your beliefs on is faith, not truth or fact. There is and never will be a shred of proof that the "truth" you stand for is fact. We can debate all you want, but that's what it comes down to. You are free to believe whatever you want, but when your beliefs cross the political line and venture into law, that's where I have a BIG problem with your kind, because with all due respect, I think your style of faith is crazy, outdated, controlling, and hateful.

"Everything you base your beliefs on is faith, not truth or fact."

Actually, that isn't the case.

There is plenty of evidence for the validity of the Bible. And while I'm not a scholar, I've stated a handful of solid evidence here before. Just because one chooses not to examine the facts doesn't extinguish the facts.

Besides, there is plenty of archeological evidence for the Bible's validity.

Ironically, this is where evidence is perhaps strongest. If you're a scientist, you'd have to admit that when Bible-believers were called fools because the Hittites were said never to have existed, the Bible was found to be correct.

There is prophetic evidence for the Bible's validity. It's found throughout the Good Book.
There is spiritual evidence for the Bible's validity. Ever hear of a miracle?

There is genealogical evidence for the Bible's validity. It's right there, from Adam to Jesus.

There is common-sense evidence for the Bible's validity. Call it natural law if you wish. Read Proverbs.

But in the end, no one is going to make you believe anything. If you want to follow lemmings off the cliff who say there is no truth, even though you know better, then that's your call.

Besides, anyone telling you there is no truth would have no problem lying about it, for there's nothing to tell them that lying is wrong, either.

If you've never read "The Case For Christ" by Lee Strobel, post your mailing address and I'll send you a copy. Aside from writings of C.S. Lewis and the Bible itself, it is one of the strongest arguements for God's Word.

http://leestrobel.com/Bible.htm

Herb

Herb has a legitimate point of view, because many others in our nation think like him. Yes, I almost never agree with him, but despite how frustrating it can be, I still think it's worth to engage him. Wayne, on the other hand, routinely makes things up or just blatantly distorts what people have said, which I find intolerable and not worthy of attention.

Andrew

Totally agree Andrew.

Herb, I've some comments on that and am interested in that conversation. Appreciated!

You really need to do what Herb has suggested.

And maybe WW you should do what the others have suggested....

Others have suggested to believe on the Lord Jesus and you will be saved.

Herb, there is no real scientific evidence that anything in the bible is true, that god exists, or anything else you believe in. NONE! Show me some physical proof and then we'll talk. Until then, all of your garbage is just that, garbage.

For all you know, everything you believe in was made up by a Ted Haggard type thousands of years ago.

Somehow I doubt if any scientific evidence could convince you the Bible is true. My mom was right: Don't confuse me with facts, my mind is made up.

OK....were is the proverbial missing link between ape and man....have not seen definitive proof on that either!

I would rather beleive that there is a Divine Creator instead of beleiving that man just crawled out of a pile of goo and sprouted legs.

There is the Neanderthal that everyone paints as early man but were they....maybe they were just Sasquatch which are now extinct...or are they?

"Herb, there is no real scientific evidence that anything in the bible is true..."

Ok. You asked a fair question. Here it is:

http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science.shtml

Here's a Ph.D. in Astronomy who finds the Bible compatible with science:
http://www.reasons.org/about/staff/ross.shtml

Science itself cannot explain how the big bang came into being. The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics states order goes to disorder [entropy].

But we look all around and see the intricacies of life. The human eye. A baby's smile.

The fingerprint of a Creator is all around us. If you walk into a city a see a building, you know an architect designed it...simply because it is there.

So explain to us how the very first atom was created? The first molecule? The first amoeba?
Talk about a leap of faith!

You have FAR MORE explaining to do than any of us who believe in a Creator.

Herb

Jamon said " I would rather beleive that there is a Divine Creator instead of beleiving that man just crawled out of a pile of goo and sprouted legs."

Why? I'm not saying there is a single thing wrong with deciding to believe that. But I don't want to assume anything. So, why? Because believing that does what, exactly, for you? How does that manifest itself in your life? Dig deep. I want to know.

Just because we don't understand how the earth came about doesn't mean YOUR ANSWER must be the correct one, Herb. People not blinded by strict view of one religion see that numerous religions of the world contradict each other so they can't ALL be "the truth." Why yours and not, say, Islam's? Honestly, people of one religion claiming that theirs and theirs alone is the "correct" one and everyone else's is just wrong look silly to me.

Andrew

I'm merely saying that rather than saying the Bible isn't true, then pray tell, what is? Tell us your view about the meaning of life. Tell us about your view about what truth is. Tell us how we were created.

It's easy asking questions, isn't it? Let's see YOUR answers.

Herb

Shouldn't we be calling this personal truth then?

In one's own eyes it can be easily be considered ultimate. I've no problem with that. It's a solid embodiment of conviction. If one has faith, it might as well be strong right?

Where does this grant one the right to enforce this on another?

I don't mean advocacy either. That's cool. We need enough tolerance in ourselves to both accept and deliver advocacy or we cannot grow as a race.

Where truth is concerned, and we can label it however we want to label it, the truth at the end of the day is that nobody can establish their particular belief as being true, in the sense that we all accept it as truth and math and logic relate it to be true.

We've had the discussion before about the law and these things. Why should we permit a law that is not based on mutually accepted truths?

God says something is wrong or sinful. Ok, who says god says? Pick a topic and you will find as many statements like this as we have words for them.

Respect for our fellow peers, and we all are peers equal in this, demands we not diminish others beliefs without solid justification for doing so. That justification comes from truth, or mutual acceptance --not from better lawyers or numbers.

Religion has always been a hot and cold thing for me and is not in my life as much as it should be.

I basically beleive in God and that after my life is over there will be an eternal resting place for my soul...whether that be heaven of hell is up for grabs.

I just want to beleive that when my life is over there is something more than just being worm food.

I am not one of these religious types who talk the talk and then piss on those in need......which is why the churches get bad reps these days...people preach the good book and then do otherwise.

It gives one hope that there is something more than the short carporial physical existance on earth.....that there is something more...something better waiting for us. Without that there is just...be born, live, and die....that's it.

That's the long and short of why I CHOOSE to beleive in GOD and always will. Everyone is entitled to their beleifs and this is mine. You could debate it forever and my mind will never change on this issue. It's part of who I am and not something I can just ignore. Whether you agree or not is perfectly fine with me but this is me and I will not force my beleifs on you

Take It Easy

You make way too much sense!

Author: Herb
Wednesday, November 15, 2006 - 3:06 pm


I'm merely saying that rather than saying the Bible isn't true, then pray tell, what is? Tell us your view about the meaning of life. Tell us about your view about what truth is. Tell us how we were created.

It's easy asking questions, isn't it? Let's see YOUR answers.

Herb

Its much easier asking questions than it is answering them isn't it?

"Where does this grant one the right to enforce this on another?"

No one here is enforcing anything on anyone.

But if the issue is a requirement to forcibly remove one's beliefs at the ballot box, that's un-American and un-democratic.

Herb

The only people who are forcing anything is the pro gay marriage crowd who wants to shove it down our throats.

Herb writes:
I'm merely saying that rather than saying the Bible isn't true, then pray tell, what is? Tell us your view about the meaning of life. Tell us about your view about what truth is. Tell us how we were created.

It's easy asking questions, isn't it? Let's see YOUR answers.

Your presumption is that we as human beings must come up with answers to these questions. I reject that point of view. I don't really question how we came about, what created us, etc. because it seems irrelevant to my life. As a kind of fun game it's interesting once in a while to consider philosophical things like the meaning of life, etc. but in the end they are not really important to me.

All I know is that I'll be on this earth a relatively short time, and I'll have to figure out my life as it happens. I can't adopt a religious point of view that seems patently false to me just out of insecurity or peer pressure - that doesn't work for me. If you can adopt a view of life that involves Jesus Christ and that works for you, more power to you. Just don't push it on me, 'kay?

Andrew

I assure you that it is neither mine nor Herb's intent to push our faith on anybody. The only pushing here is from the left who insist on shoving their gay marriage agenda down our throats and some of us are getting a bit tired of it. One doesn't convert somebody by smearing and swearing which the pro gay crowd seems to love to do.

Anybody who claims to have the answers is a LIAR!! Nobody knows why we're here or how we got here, NOBODY!! You can have your hope and faith to calm your mind, but the question will never be answered. So don't tell me god says this or that, because you have NO PROOF of what he or she says or if one even exists!! NONE!!! To assume god exists because the world is too complex to comprehend is naive. I'm gonna need more than quotes from a fable to convince me.

Thats your problem if you want to not believe not mine. Your issue is with God not with me. You would never believe in God no matter what kind of proof we offer you. The only proof you need is in the Bible If you won't believe what God has written down you won't believe anything else.

I won't try to convince you....I won't not try to convince you....you believe as you will and that is your business, I believe as I will and that is my business. If you ask me which someone did, I will try to answer honestly and as best I can. In the end it is what is inside each of us that matters. I frankly could care less (well maybe a little) about what other people think of me because I am secure in myself as a descent person, and that is good enough for me.

This Now Concludes This Broadcast...Signing Off Now

I wish the others thought that way.

It's common sense:

By their fruits you will know them. Do you gather grapes from thorns, or figs from thistles?
Even so, every good tree produces good fruit; but the corrupt tree produces evil fruit.
A good tree can't produce evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree produce good fruit.

Every tree that doesn't grow good fruit is cut down, and thrown into the fire.
Therefore, by their fruits you will know them.
Matthew 7:16-20

BELIEF IN GOD
Abraham Lincoln
George Washington
Thomas Jefferson
C.S. Lewis
Martin Luther
Deitrich Bonhoeffer
Martin Luther King, Jr.

ATHEIST
Stalin
Marx
Hitler
Mao Tse Tung
Pol Pot
Castro
Nikita Kruschev
Kim Il Sung
Kim Jong Il

By their fruits you will know them.
Herb

Belief in God:

Marwan al-Shehhi
Fayez Banihammad
Mohand al-Shehri
Hamza al-Ghamdi
Ahmed al-Ghamdi
Hani Hanjour
Khalid al-Mihdhar
Majed Moqed
Nawaf al-Hazmi
Salem al-Hazmi
Ziad Jarrah
Ahmed al-Haznawi
Ahmed al-Nami
Saeed al-Ghamdi
Waleed al-Shehri
Wail al-Shehri
Abdulaziz al-Omari
Satam al-Suqami
Mohamed Atta

----

Andrew

I should have known that a liberal would compare George Washington and Abraham Lincoln to Mohamed Atta.

By their fruits you will know them. This also applies to leftists.

Herb

I wasn't comparing Washington to Atta, Herb, you were. I was merely pointing out that people who profess a belief in God can be some of the most evil, vile human beings the planet has ever known. Whether one professes belief in God or not has no bearing on what kind of person one is.

Andrew

I say that anyone who claims that he believes in God but is vile is probably not any believer at all, except in name. The proof is in the pudding.
Hitler was into the occult.

"people who profess a belief in God can be some of the most evil, vile human beings the planet has ever known."

May I introduce one WHITE American, Baptist minister Rev. Fred Phelps.

http://www.godhatesfags.com/

Why God hasn't sent a lightning bolt this way is beyond me.

Wow Skep, at least he has the common decency to put up a warning page.

Maybe God can bend Rev. Phelps over and find a good place for that lightning bolt.

WW said>>>
I assure you that it is neither mine nor Herb's intent to push our faith on anybody.

LOL!!!! That has got to be a joke!!!!!

Herb just got SMOKED by Andrew! Best post I've seen in ages. Couldn't have responded better myself.

WW said>>>
Hitler was into the occult.

So your hero was into the Devil??? And you call yourself a Christian..... OUCH!

Author: Trixter
Wednesday, November 15, 2006 - 11:10 pm


WW said>>>
I assure you that it is neither mine nor Herb's intent to push our faith on anybody.

LOL!!!! That has got to be a joke!!!!!

its a joke because the left are the only ones doing the pushing.

That is a lie Wayner and you know it! If you beileve that your insane.

OK....Enough....Everyone get a can of the following:

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b11/Lotek_Racing/troll.jpg

LOL

I believe in Science...and while I think the bible has some basis in fact, you cannot convince me that after thousands of years and several languages...this book can't be "God's word." Not all languages translate into each other, men by default are not perfect...and thousands of years warps stories.

I don't know...believe what you want, but I'm zen with the fact that death is death. All things organic die. Things wear out.

I have my opinions about faith, most of which I won't discuss here (my goal is for a civil conversation...and religion is a hot-button issue for most folks).

I grew up Catholic and there were just so many questions that were never answered. Which is fine, but I can't just have blind faith in something...and I'm ok with not knowing a thing or two...I don't always need an explanation.

"I grew up Catholic and there were just so many questions that were never answered."

This was an interesting read I came across yesterday ...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20061114/lf_afp/usreligioncatholic_061114185427

What concerns me most is the fact that the Catholic church is seriously considering making it so ANYONE "living in sin", whether it be gays or any other kind of "sin" CANNOT receive the sacrament. Yeah, way to be inclusive and build up that following.

Not poo-pooing your religion growing up, it just seems a bit un-Christianlike to tell members that they cannot be part of the plan because they aren't good enough Catholics.

hey just because I grew up that way doesn't mean I still practice....

But that's the thing that concerns me about the catholics and most other christian religions...it seems like a club...and as long as you follow MOST of the rules, they'll look the other way when you break one or two.

There's a reason confession exists....

Funny you should mention Catholics. I got a letter yesterday from the Cardinal Newman Society have you heard of them? I was a bit surprized that they contacted me because I have never been a Catholic. They had a survey that had questions on whether or not I agreed with the Catholic church's position on the matter we were arguing about.

Well, they're nutjobs and so are you, so maybe you should send them a donation!

Plus, Newman was a mail carrier before he got this gig, so you two have something else in common. And he needs that money NOW!


(Whooooossssh! that one flew right on past WW)

Hey, his name is Wayne, too! (whooosh squared!)

No I knew he was asking for money because it said so in his letter. I want to know how he knew about me!

God must've gave him your phone number.

Did he ask you if your refrigerator was running?

"No I knew he was asking for money because it said so in his letter."

That's pretty amazing, since he died in 1890! Did he sign it? Are you sure he didn't call?

The "Society" are fellow right wing zealots, that's how they got your address, pal



Do you have Olive Oyl in a can?
How about Prince Albert?

Pete: Yes Sir! That's a high quality, rare *Plonk* indeed.

Then why haven't I heard of that group before? Aren't I supposed to know who the "righties" are?

A: Because they're a minority faction that are pretty much ignored and criticized.

Ever heard of Google, you dilrod? It's the latest thing! You should try it sometime.

Perhaps he's just not feeling lucky?

(bada boom!)

Rules...Rules...Rules...Can nobody read the FRACKIN Rules?

http://feedback.pdxradio.com/show.cgi?tpc=2186&post=156463#POST156463

nobody can read here!

Okay, boys and girls, let me try something entirely different and we'll see if it works.

The choice to be a troll is an individual choice. But once a troll, your reputation follows you forever, no matter where you go. See, posts on the internet are permanent. Trolling here in PDXradio.com DOES have consequences elsewhere. In no time at all one can dig up information based a troll's own posts in this forum.

Have a happy day and God bless Google.

Birthday: October 17, 1946
a.k.a.: ***** *****
Gender: Male
Location: Portland Oregon
Biography:
I am 58 years old single and have several CD's filled with Warner Brothers cartoons as well as the Hucklebery Hound and Warner Brothers series. I also have collected several Popeye cartoons from when they were on the Cartoon Network My hometown is also the hometown of Mel Blanc.
Occupation: retired Post Office Clerk
Favorite Cartoons:
Popeye meets Ali Baba Bully for Bugs, Beep Prepared, the Scarlet Pumpernickel, I Haven't Got a Hat.
Other Interests:
working out at a health club, my church, and my sports teams and my computer.

I can still find some of my first words on the net, posted in the very early 90's.

The net remembers for a really long time.

Don't worry, I won't post the link to your fan mail to Dragon Tales.

Man, that's nothing... (I think. Is that a cartoon?)

There is more than a few embarrasing ass whoopins (my ass, not the other guy) that are floating out there somewhere...

The net is a wonderful, if brutal, teacher!

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe/11/17/britain.webrage.reut/index.html

Author: Joamon4sure
Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 8:06 pm


Rules...Rules...Rules...Can nobody read the FRACKIN Rules?

http://feedback.pdxradio.com/show.cgi?tpc=2186&post=156463#POST156463

It's ok Wayne. I'm not going to hurt you. I just want to touch you.

And I will be touching you very soon.

Wayne, do you drive? Something you said a long time ago makes me think that you don't drive.

Is that true?

Who told you that? I have driven for 40 years and have only 3 or 4 tickets. Why do you ask?

and by the way I would love to meet you in person CJ! There is an Elmers thats a few blocks from where I live.

Maybe we can all meet at Club 205. That's close to your house as well.

I play poker right by your house every couple weeks. Just like 3 blocks away. I'll call your home phone and invite you the next time.

I would love to meet you and Pete at Elmers near mall 205. Thats pretty convenient. What time and date? Any date would work for me except on Saturday evenings or Sunday morning. Maybe Sunday evening?

The next time I am coming out that way, I'll let you know. Heck, you could walk to the poker game.

I want to put a photo of myself in my profile so you will know what I look like but I am not sure how to do that.

I drove by Red Robin just now and I was wondering what you think of meeting there instead of Elmers. Thats a block west of there.
we could do it on Friday so Craig if he wants to can join us.

Its a block east of Elmers actually. So I can't tell east from west!

I'm not gay, so I dont' think I want to meet with you.

Are you sure? You are so pushy about it I wonder.

Of course you do Wayne... When you pent it up for so long it's hard to hold back. I don't think Pete wishes to meet with you anywhere.
This summer it's okay if you show up at the beach house with your boyfriend we accept EVERYONE.....

It's not very often that I actually "LOL" when somebody uses that bit of net shorthand, but I did LOL at Trixter's post.

Author: Trixter
Monday, November 20, 2006 - 12:35 am


Of course you do Wayne... When you pent it up for so long it's hard to hold back. I don't think Pete wishes to meet with you anywhere.
This summer it's okay if you show up at the beach house with your boyfriend we accept EVERYONE.....

------
It takes one to know one Trix.

Oooooh, good one! so mature! So clever!

Without getting too Jaquel on everybody, It reminds me of the brilliance of:

"The jerk store called, and they're running out of YOU!

Have some shrimp, Wayne.

(damn near spits out coffee)

Good grief!

I'm thinking that brain is so far gone a lobotomy would not make one bit of difference.

Author: Mrs_merkin
Monday, November 20, 2006 - 11:34 pm


Oooooh, good one! so mature! So clever!

Without getting too Jaquel on everybody, It reminds me of the brilliance of:

"The jerk store called, and they're running out of YOU!

Have some shrimp, Wayne.

-----
I LOVE shrimp.

Wayne:

The bible refers to shrimp exactly the same way it refers to homosexuality -- an abomination. You can't have it both ways.

Leviticus 11, verses 9-12: "These you may eat of all that are in the water: whatever ... has fins and scales... that you may eat. But in all the seas or in the rivers that do not have fins and scales... they are an abomination to you... you shall not eat their flesh."

1 Corinthians 6:9-10

Romans 1:26-27

1 Timothy 1:10

Herb

49ers: 20 Seahawks: 17

Author: Algernon
Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 1:45 pm


Wayne:

The bible refers to shrimp exactly the same way it refers to homosexuality -- an abomination. You can't have it both ways.

Leviticus 11, verses 9-12: "These you may eat of all that are in the water: whatever ... has fins and scales... that you may eat. But in all the seas or in the rivers that do not have fins and scales... they are an abomination to you... you shall not eat their flesh."

-----------
Jews had restrictions on what they could eat or what they couldn't. They still can't eat pork that I know of. For me eating fish doesn't make me feel guilty in the least. We are under the time of grace and not under the law. I believe that the death of Jesus is the fullfillment of the law. Not that its not important.But only through him can we obey the law.Tell me something: Do you drink alcohol? Have you never read what the Scriptures say about being drunk? Thats as much of a sin as eating meat! And being drunk can cause a lot more problems than meat or fish can. I have seen it personally.

Homosexuality is never acceptable in God's eyes and is forbidden in the New Testament as well as the Old and also by Jesus.

Give it a rest with the fucking religion bullshit!! This IS NOT a church!!

Herb and Wayner...
Thanks for TRYING to make this Church.

I'm openin' up a can of WHOOP ASS!

Austin 3:16

Its not church its the truth and the truth needs to be told. God can work quite capably outside of church.

Your truth is fiction at best. Sucks to be you.

"Do you drink alcohol?"

Jesus did.

Herb

Author: Reinstatepete
Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 7:27 pm


Your truth is fiction at best. Sucks to be you.

-------
Its not my truth you are rejecting its God's truth.

God's truth as you understand it is 2/3rds false according to the people who brought it to the world centuries ago.

The Bible is mostly fiction. Catholicism weighed in on this pretty plainly this year. They'd prefer people who study the Bible keep that FACT in mind when they look to it for guidance.

Also, as to the title of this thread: You guys talk more about ignoring people than actually doing it. I don't get it. Either admit you NEED these two in order to you to get your rocks off beating up on stupid people, or ignore them. But convincing yourself you're fighting the good fight and doing something worthy by slamming your forehead against the trollish brick wall they've been throwing up fucking EXPERTLY is silly.

I'm glad you set an example of ignoring trolls when you posted this reminder NOT!). I don't think we "need" trolls, but in one case, we have a spectacular troll speicman (sp) and we're examining it to death. I think we're pretty much done, but there are those here that love tit-for-tat and I wish they'd stop.

I need them.

There.

Nobody seems to have ignored me yet!

Hey FatBoy.....

Little tip for you
Look at the number of post's the thread has before entering...if more than 50 you can bet Wayne, Herb, and the rest of the Head Bangers are all in there.....good place to steer clear of!!!!

There are a couple of exceptions like the alcohol thread but just look at the topic.....if political and more than 50 post's....most likely just the basher brothers (Wayne and Herb) at work stirring up discontent!!!

cj, I suggest you get a dog. their responses are always loving and loyal. the only lying they do is the lay down kind. and they keep their religious views between themselves and their God.

"(Wayne and Herb) at work stirring up discontent!!!"

Last time I checked, this website was about the exchange of ideas.

Liberals also herald themselves as desiring diversity. That is, UNLESS the topic is something with which they disagree.

Otherwise, the tactic is to attempt to silence the very diversity they claim to strive for. Witness the horribly poor treatment of the pro-Life Mr. Casey at the democrat convention. Witness the horribly poor treatment of Mr. Lieberman.

Dissent is not tolerated within the democrat party. Why should we expect it to be tolerated outside of the democrat party?

Many liberals on this site wish to squelch everything and everyone but their own liberal agenda.

And then they call those with different opinions 'Nazis.' That's precisely the kind of strategy Mr. Hitler himself used with the Reichstag building fire.

Herb

"Dissent is not tolerated within the democrat party. Why should we expect it to be tolerated outside of the democrat party?"

I'm crushed.

"Dissent is not tolerated within the democrat party."

Oh really? And dissent is tolerated in the GOP? And dissent is tolerated in your bigoted religion?

Spare me your drivel, Herbert.

Most people on this site, left or right, strive for educated debate. Unfortunately, several of the posters representing the extreme right in this forum are not educated. Why is this? Is it just dumb luck that those reprenting the extreme right are really just ignorant, therefore they ARE the extreme right? Or is it a requirement to be ignorant in order to believe what the extreme right believes? Which is it?

There is overwhelming evidence, based on what I've seen on this site, that those on the extreme right are ignorant. If I was a moderately conservative person, I would be embarrassed by what I read here.

The only people who are "ignorant" are those who don't see everything the way you do.

Hey Wayne, you know, you've said that a lot of times. Let me ask you; Do you believe that there is anyone on Earth that is ignorant? You don't have to name them or support it - but do you? Do you think there is anyone who is ignorant?

Anyone at all. Do you?

WW said>>>>
The only people who are "ignorant" are those who don't see everything the way you do.

Wayner look in the mirror.....

I don't expect everyone to see things as I do. However, I expect that people support their beliefs with facts, and that is a burden you've yet to meet, and probably never will. As a result, I've got no other choice but to believe that you are ignorant. If anyone here disagrees with my assessment, please feel free to prove me wrong.

That's not gonna happen anytime soon.

Agreed completely, BTW.

Proving you wrong would be 100% IMPOSSIBLE!

Author: Chickenjuggler
Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 11:19 am


Hey Wayne, you know, you've said that a lot of times. Let me ask you; Do you believe that there is anyone on Earth that is ignorant? You don't have to name them or support it - but do you? Do you think there is anyone who is ignorant?

Anyone at all. Do you?

---------
My question to you is can any conservative be smart? It seems to me like you are equating intelligence with liberalism. Or better with agreement.

Wayner that is the most IGNORANT statement I have ever seen you post here.....

Wouldn't he make a great witness at a trial!!! Never any answers to direct questions....just redirect questions to questions. Must be nice to never ever have to answer any questions put to you!!!!

He would make an excellent Dodge Ball player if he can dodge the ball the same way he dodges questions!!! Eventually though you will turn around and take one square in the face!!! Wham....lights out!!! LOL

I think you are saying that one has to be liberal to be smart, Trix. At least you can't prove otherwise without trashing someone

No, it's no problem. That's a fair question, Wayne. I'll answer it.

Yes. Yes I do believe that there are people who are ignorant. By any definition of the word, there are people who are. That's what I believe.

And Yes. Yes I do believe that a conservative can be smart.

Now, what do you believe? Do you believe that there is anyone on Earth that is ignorant. Conservative and Liberal labels aside - are there any ignorant people on Earth?

Author: Joamon4sure
Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 1:18 pm


Wouldn't he make a great witness at a trial!!! Never any answers to direct questions....just redirect questions to questions. Must be nice to never ever have to answer any questions put to you!!!!

He would make an excellent Dodge Ball player if he can dodge the ball the same way he dodges questions!!! Eventually though you will turn around and take one square in the face!!! Wham....lights out!!! LOL

---------
At least at a trial a court would have much more respect for different opinions than they do here.

Wayner would you pull your head out! I'm 100% Republican and if you can't understand that you are just as ignorant as everyone else here think you are.
JHC! PULL IT OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!

Author: Chickenjuggler
Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 1:59 pm


No, it's no problem. That's a fair question, Wayne. I'll answer it.

Yes. Yes I do believe that there are people who are ignorant. By any definition of the word, there are people who are. That's what I believe.

And Yes. Yes I do believe that a conservative can be smart.

Now, what do you believe? Do you believe that there is anyone on Earth that is ignorant. Conservative and Liberal labels aside - are there any ignorant people on Earth?

---------------
I am not sure what your point is in asking the question here. I believe that liberals can be as ignorant as conservatives are. Its a bit unfair to say that someone is ignorant only because he disagrees with you. Why are some people so above saying "I disagree?"

Author: Trixter
Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 2:02 pm


Wayner would you pull your head out! I'm 100% Republican and if you can't understand that you are just as ignorant as everyone else here think you are.
JHC! PULL IT OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!

-----
I have a hard time believing you Trix. I think you have the notion that everyone you don't agree with is ignorant. Can you name one post you disagreed with that was NOT ignorant??

"Its a bit unfair to say that someone is ignorant only because he disagrees with you."

Yeah. I never said that. You did.

So you DO believe that there are ignorant poeple on Earth.

Thank you.

Nothing that you post that's for GD sure!

GOOD Fin BYE

I'm done trying.....

True Republicans do not act as you Wayner. ONLY EXTREME NAZI neo-CONers do.....

C YA!

See.....dodged that direct question twice.....why bother?????

Why do you ask a question in which you already have an answer in mind? I hate playing that game. I would much rather you tell me what your intent is in asking the question.

"I would much rather you tell me what your intent is in asking the question."

I have. We ALL have. But then you pretend to get lost in the logic. So we have to take you by your hand and walk you through it.

But even then it's futile because you can't focus. All the while you feign that it's not a gentlemanly mannerish enough for you.

A MAN could answer a question.

A MAN could back it up.

A MAN would stop leaping to conclusions.

A MAN would be more aware of his surroundings instead of burning bridges of possible understanding.

And it all applies to WOMEN too.

Wayne, I UNDERSTAND you. YOU don't understand anything but what YOU believe. You just don't understand. You can't think outside of your box. Not even to the end of changing your mind or or remining to disagree. You just do not consider anything but what you've decided to be true. I think that's why you say " Don't bother me with facts when my mind is made up." That's your way of saying " I'm not open to new ideas. Different perspectives count for nothing to me."

" I would suggest "...that you are wrong every time you say " I would suggest." EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. In fact, it's such a barometer of how strong a debate point is against you, that it reminds of of President Bush; Every time he gives his public support to someone in his administration, LOOK OUT. They are getting fired.

" I would suggest " is THAT reliable of a phrase from you.

And that's not very gentlemanly.

I wish you would allow me to disagree with you. I guess thats asking too much on this forum. If you want to get along with everybody there seems to be a requirement that we hate Bush and America. Why do you care so much about my blind agreement?

Name ONE way in which I have not allowed you to disagree with me. Blind agreement to what? The only thing you have shown blind agreement to is the way The President thinks.

I don't care about THAt though. That's why I SAID that I don't. But, as usual, you didn't read the post.

I think you start to read a post, you think you get it, then you just start typing.

And that is ignorant. Not manly at all.

Lobotomies, electro-shock therapies, all useless. Nothing short of ignoring will do the trick.

It's really easy to disagree.

Saying you agree to disagree, means some level of acceptance for both parties or all parties having a rational point of view.

Most of what you have posted here does not meet that criteria. It's invalid on a whole bunch of levels, and that is where the problem is.

I won't often do it, unless the other party has made points that don't fail on their own merit.

You make circular arguments completely full of fallacies and often confuse truths, facts and beliefs.

Agreeing to disagree, given these things are in place, validates your point of view and simply reinforces your issues. That would actually do you more harm than good in the longer term.

You and the other libs are clear that you want agreement here. Everytime people call me "ignorant" or swear that proves to me that my blind agreement matters a great deal. What we need to realize is that there are issues on which agreement is impossible here. Can't you see there is honor in disagreement in a gentlemanly manner?

No because the world doesn't work that way. If you say something that is ignorant, you will get called out for it. THAT'S a GOOD thing for humanity.

When you say "ignorant" what you are really saying is that you don't agree. But for some people they can't say they don't agree. Why are you so above saying you disagree? My blind agreement is all that matters here.

I think we're dealing with an IQ below 80.

don't be so hard on yourself.

Totally.

We've got people from all over the political spectrum here saying the same thing:

SUPPORT YOUR VIEWS WITH FACTS!

Using labels, such as: "Leftist, Libs, Securalists, etc.." makes your primary point false on that basis alone. Before we even get to the "we agree to disagree part", you've lost it right there!

Circular arguments are false as well. You cannot expect someone else to agree to disagree when you present your points with a self-supporting point of view.

Confusing truth, fact, belief, faith, etc... does you no good. Statements like: "Like it or not, we are all born sinners.", or "Take it up with the guy upstairs, your problem is with him, not me." are meaningless when it comes to any sort of debate, or even enlightenment as to anothers point of view, or yours.

If you expect to get a rational, "We agree to disagree" you've actually got to bring something to the table that can be disagreed with!

Posting dogma, BS, fallacies and other non points of discussion won't get you there.

Be a gentleman and give others here something worth their time and you will get the same in return. This has been a constant in this forum since before I came here.

It's exactly why I came here.

I've personally not posted as much lately. Why? Because it's somewhat less worth my time. That's largely on you, continuing to bring the discussion back to this shit.

You are not alone though. We see a lotta Nixon here too, no matter what the topic.

You've got religious objections to some stuff. Fine. That's understandable --it's also defensible if you try. Trust me when I say, "Pastor Abel said so" just does not cut it no matter how great you think he is.

BTW: I've put the tough questions on equality, your representation of their theology and your characterization of that church here to him. My response?

ZIP, nada, nothing!

Why?

This crap is not defensible and he knows it just as anyone else willing to actually think about it does.

I don't expect agreement. In fact, it's better when we don't because there is something to be learned when all parties push hard. Something shakes out that's probably worth some serious consideration.

Probably yet another waste of time, but I'm gonna say it anyway because it's the right thing to do. Step up and return the favor in like kind huh?

...or leave. Keep doing what you are doing and all you do is annoy a wider circle of people and marginalize yourself each time.

This does you no good, unless you find it thearaputic somehow and even that's a false good. It also devalues your faith in others eyes. The only people willing to respect you, given your current behavior, are those already in the family, so to speak. Preaching to the choir.

Nobody is gonna read the crap you post here and think, "Damn! This guy gets it. I'm gonna learn more." Fucking nobody Wayner.

By contrast, nearly every other contributor here brings something of value to the table. What their view is does not matter. The fact that they are willing and able to bring it to us for consideration does, and I thank them for that.

I'm guilty of getting sucked in again. Thought you were gonna step up a little and engaged just a little. A few of us did.

Here we are again, with a majority of posts aimed at this largely useless discussion. I swear it's all about simply doing whatever it takes to keep the attention focused on your bull shit, simply to keep anything else that could be a threat off the table as much as is possible.

It's working, gotta give you credit for that.

Guess I really need to just suck it up and hold the line. Others here are and they've not been recognized for their efforts.

Sorry guys, I'll do better going forward.

You won't buy any facts you don't agree with. Agreement is everything. Thats the ONLY way we can be gentlemen here! Why don't you admit that all you care about is my blind agreement?

http://www.criticalthinking.org

Oh STFU already...You are starting to really piss me off. All you do is stir up shit, ignore questions, no backup to the crap that you post, and just plain STUPID.....sorry guys but ignorance can be taught...."What we are dealing with here is failure to communicate!" You can't cure STUPID! I will give this internet troll credit though...he is pretty masterful at laying out troll bait. Must be due to years of practice on mom's computer! QUIT TAKING THE BAIT! You guys complain about him....just ignore and do not respond...pretty simple...but I have a hunch some people actually like to talk smack back and forth with him. IMHO the man is a complete DORK! All he ever does is double talk, dodge questions, and never substantiate anything that dribbles off his keyboard!

Yep.

You've nailed it. He's the real deal.

I answer everyone of your questions Jo. You need to realize that not everyone in the world will agree with everything you say. Is it possible at all to disagree in a gentlemanly manner? The answer is an obvious "NO!"

And you've proved it with every keystroke.

off topic just a bit . . . hiding behind a computer offers cowards a chance to do things that normally would have them tarred and feathered just a few short years ago.

Picture the troll tarred and feathered and ignore it.

http://www.bcmm.org/images/photo_album/misc/pic59.jpg

I never see you answer any questions with a yes or no...just double talk and avoidance. You would have more credibility if you actually responded to questions asked you without the duck and dodge. I usally do not like to talk ill of people but you really need to step back and open your eyes.....how you inter-act with people here....and some of their responses as well are totally, excuse me, BULLSHIT! Just answer a freakin question for once from your gut....quit over analyzing and reading things into the questions......this back and forth bickering is so pointless it is almost funny....but it is truly sad. Quit thinking every question is an attack on you and your beleifs......ever think that by answering them that people may get a better take on you and may one day even appreciate your input. Until you can just answer questions posed to you without overthinking them nobody will ever take you for anything other than someone who just likes to knock over the ant hill and watch them scurry around!

I answer every one of your questions. What you need to realize is that you can't make the whole world agree with you! You think that by pressuring me and by cussing at me that it will wear me down enough to agree with you. Nothing else seems to matter here but my blind agreement.

I am not asking you to agree with anything....but to just answer questions that people ask you. You think everyone here is out for you...well because you never answer their questions they mostly are...but you painted yourself into the corner now let the paint dry and take a different approach.

Sure you want me to agree. Why do you keep denying that obvious truth? You are fishing for agreement, thats it. Why else do you ask the question at all? If I give an answer you don't like would it ever satisfy you? My expeirience with others at least is no.

Read This.....

Not Answering Challenges to a Claim
When trying to make a case for some position or idea, we frequently encounter questions which challenge the coherency or validity of that position. When we are able to adequately answer those questions, our position becomes stronger. When we cannot answer the questions, then our position is weaker. If, however, we avoid the question altogether, then our reasoning process itself is revealed as possibly weak.

It is unfortunately common that many important questions and challenges go unanswered — but why do people do this? There are surely many reasons, but a common one may be a desire to avoid admitting that they might be wrong. They might not have a good answer, and while “I don’t know” is certainly acceptable, it may represent an unacceptable admission of at least potential error.

Another possible reason is that answering the question might lead one to the realization that their position isn’t valid, but that position plays an important role in their self-image. For example, someone’s ego might be dependent upon the premise that some other group is inferior to them — in such a situation, the person might be strongly inclined not to directly answer questions about the justification of that alleged inferiority, otherwise they might have to acknowledge that they aren’t so superior after all.

Not every instance where a person seems to be avoiding the question qualifies as such — sometimes a person may think that they answered it earlier or at another point in the process. Sometimes a genuine answer doesn’t immediately look like an answer. Consider:

Patient: Is my condition life threatening, doctor?
Doctor: We’ll need to do more tests before we can determine that.
In this example the doctor has told the patient that she doesn’t know if his condition is life threatening, but she didn’t say that outright. Thus, although it could appear as though she avoided the question, in reality she did give an answer — perhaps one which she thought would be a bit more gentle. Contrast that with the following:

Patient: Is my condition life threatening, doctor?
Doctor: Don’t worry about that right now. You get some rest tonight and I’ll be by tomorrow.
Here, the doctor has avoided answering the question entirely. There is no hint that the doctor still needs to do more work in order to arrive at an answer; instead, we get an evasion that sounds suspiciously like he doesn’t want to face telling his patient that she might die.

When someone avoids direct and challenging questions, that does not justify concluding that their position is wrong; it is very possible that their position is 100% correct. Instead, what we can conclude is that the reasoning process which leads them to assert their position may be flawed. A strong reasoning process requires that one either have already dealt with or be capable of addressing important issues. This, of course, means being able to answer challenging questions.

Typically when a person avoids answering a question, that question was posed by another person in a debate or discussion. In such cases the person is not only evincing flawed reasoning, but also violating basic principles of discussion. If you are going to engage in a conversation with someone, you need to be willing to address their comments, concerns, and queries. If you don’t, then it’s no longer a two-way exchange of information and views.

However, that isn’t the only context in which a person might avoid answering questions. It’s also possible to describe that as occurring even when a person is alone with his thoughts and considering a new idea. In such cases they will surely face a variety of questions they ask themselves, and they might avoid answering them for some of the reasons suggested above.

Puhleeze - he's not able to read that.

"Sure you want me to agree. Why do you keep denying that obvious truth?"

You know what? You have cut to the one truth that actually exists; You are deNYING the truth that is shown to you.

And that is rude.

Jesus I hope you are writing a book. Or a column for Highlights for Children. Something. Anything. You've gotten NOwhere with ANYbody. Does that not clue you in to anything? Maybe you are just wrong. EVERY TIME!

>>...a column for Highlights for Children.

GOOFUS dodges questions, puts words in people's mouths and makes up "facts" on the fly.

GALLENT writes thoughtful responses, cites sources and provides helpful new information.

(I sorta' miss those two guys.)

Why.....They are right here!!!

Gosh Randy, I haven't thought about Goofus and Gallent in 30 years!

I've never even heard of them, and I'm not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing.

Love it Randy! Hilarious, but I prefer

Thump and Thumper

What is NOT avoiding a question Jo? Isn't that agreement? it sure sounds like it to me! What I wonder is if its possible to disagree with you and answer any question?

Thump, thump, thumpetty, thump thump thump!

Yes It Is!

"Another mile or two to 'Frisco,
200 gallons from L.A.
The engine's thumping like a disco,
we oughta' dump her in the bay..."

Thumpetty thump, thump away!

Hey, hey, HEY!

Gonna get my way today!

all these people with their bad headaches. You need an asprin.

Some of em need Midol and Vikadin! LOL

I don't think that would help!!

I could use the Vikadin myself!!!
Think my insomnia is back.

They say if you drink enough coffee it can make you tired.

They say if you drive your car off a cliff you will die.....

Have you tried that yet, Trix? Why don't you let us know!

I'm waiting for your TAX PAYERS PENSION loafing ass....
Remember to close your tired weary eyes on the way down. YOU have NOTHING to worry about because God will save you.....

My pension doesn't work that way.

I payed into it for YOU for years and now your using it to be online.... That sucks! I want my money back now!!!!!!
Get in that GD car NOW! Find that cliff.....

No you didn't we each payed into it ourselves. You don't deserve a dime.

Who do you think you're fooling? You are such a dumb-ass liar!

(Although I'm on the FERS plan, not the CSRS plan like you.)

You are one too. We pay into it ourselves. At least the CSRS one is like that. The taxpayers don't pay that much into it. If it did so what? Don't taxpayers pay into social security too? When you retire I am not going to be too anxious to pay for yours either.

poop poop poop . . .

By the time I'm collecting SS, you'll be worm food and quite disappointed in all the bullshit you fell for while here on earth.

It will be awhile before you get it. By then gay marriage will be the law and I will be dead and you think you will be happy but you won't.

Big brown splat o' runny poop on WW for lying AND contradicting himself yet again.

Trix:
"I payed into it for YOU for years and now your using it to be online"

WW:
"My pension doesn't work that way."
"We pay into it ourselves."
"At least the CSRS one is like that. The taxpayers don't pay that much into it. If it did so what?"

Me (ex-Fed employee):
While it's NOT mandatory, and you're an idiot if you don't, even if you choose not to save and get matching funds, you still get something (2-3%?) which IS funded by the Gov't (read taxpayers)!



I seriously believe WW is mentally retarded. There's no other explanation for this total bullshit regarding federal retirement.

I'm so done with WW, but I couldn't let this pile of corn crap "pass"...

Poop Poop Poop. Go change your pants Wayne,

Remember: yellow in the front, brown in back.

Wayne, I've been wondering, how did you avoid military service? You seem to be the perfect age for Vietnam.

Whats it to you?

Just wondering if you were one of the draft dodgers like Cheney who were afraid to fight for this country — like I did — but enjoy seeing our youth dying today.

Where do you get the silly notion he enjoys seeing people die? I believe Cheney served in the military

Wayne, I didn't mean to scare you away, I just want to know if anyone besides Nwokie who supports the wars ever served in one.

I did enlist in the Air Force in 66 but was in for only a short time. I wanted to get the draft out of my life. In fact I went in 25 years to the day after my dad did.

I want to know why you were in "for only a short time". Obviously, they got rid of you early for a very good reason.

Cheney served in the Military???
Huh???

there IS something going on here . . . "short time", "retired early", "changed church" et al. there is another side to these statments.

Wayner wont tell the truth is his hero Hitler came back from the dead to ask him.....

I don't believe Cheney served. Didn't he get some deferments, or was it DUII's?

6 I think..
But that's Wayner lying again!