It's a fricking mess. Any thread where it is possible to turn toward religion has been turned. No serious conversation of any kind can actually happen here now.

Guess that means we are all saved huh?

In protest, missing_kskd is now gone.

Eat shit you bible thumping asses.

Damn Nazis!

It sounds like there is a motion that needs to be put to the board and moderator.

All those in favor of ousting Wayne & Herb signify with either:

You betcha.....boot em'

or

I like pounding my head against a brick wall so let them stay!

It's not our call. And for good reason.

There are people like those two everywhere in the world. However backwards their logic or lack of support and not really wanting to explore anything but their own circle, they exist. Gotta deal with them.

Missing has, and we all know he wins. Even if he leaves, he wins.

at the very least, ignore them.

Yep. But it only takes one to start the mess. Chances of that happening are next to zero. We've seen that empirically.

There comes a point where the time and energy spent here does not return enough to make the whole effort viable.

My old identity here was an optimist in these things. Trusting social norms to do their thing. Clearly that's not gonna happen any time soon.

Not sure what the right solution is, that keeps balance for everyone. Not sure balance for everyone is warranted, given some will abuse no matter what.

All I know is that I no longer give a rats ass. Those of you here, who are great, are gonna have to ride this one through. If you make it, well maybe I'll tag along for the ride.

If you don't....

I've found some new haunts --computing and technology related that are quite interesting and refreshing. The value proposition is there for sure. Interestingly the politics and religion stuff is by request only...

For those techy among us --a new chip design has been born. Very cool device. It's a true deterministic multi-processor. The first edition of the CPU is microcontroller scale. Very powerful for it's size. Punches well above it's weight.

The next one, due in a year will easily be mini-computer sized. Again, it wlll punch well above it's weight. In 5 years, this design will compete nicely with existing multi-core, multi-thread designs.

Damn cool stuff. Worth my time, frankly.

In the past I've preferred the minimalist approach to moderation which allows us to settle our differences as adults. However, certain posters in our midst have repeatedly shown themselves incapable of adult behavior. Some of it spills over to the radio side.

Explaining our beefs to those individuals in great detail only brings responses of more false words put into our mouths, false accusations that we idolize tyrannical despots, and other evidence they either don't fully read our posts before responding, or cannot/do not comprehend our explanations.

As has been said by other posters, virtually every thread has been trashed by certain individuals who meet the established definitions of trolls.

In my opinion it is now time for the moderator to moderate.

As long as those individuals are allowed to continue name-calling, putting false words in our mouths, twisting our statements to unintended meanings, and leveling false accusations against us, I WILL NOT DONATE ANOTHER DIME TO HELP MR. PACKARD KEEP THIS SITE OPERATIONAL!!!!

If those individuals are removed, I will continue to donate.

I'm a religious person who believes religion posts have ruined the forum. I've lost interest in posting as a result.

And that's from someone that sides with Herb and Wayner MOST of the time.....

Thanks DJ!

Do you think we should ban Christianity?

Points proven.

No.

We should ban people abusing this forum. Specifically, taking every available (and not so available) opening to push their shit onto others, who may or may not be interested.

Randy, I too am now in favor of some stronger moderation. IMHO, we can keep it real --even tolerating the occasional spat, without having to deal with this.

I'm all for it and will abide by whatever rules come as a result of it. --Just not gonna invest in it, until I see I'll get something back in return.

Sorry all, but I've given too damn much to feel bad about this stand. Many of you others have too.

WW....
Do you think they should ban Liberlism???? Left wing thinking???

Take it upon yourselves to ignore the trolls and the flames.
It's been suggested many times, but some just can't resist
responding.

When the best response is no response, exercise that option.

Been there, done that many times. It didn't work.

Another way to look at it:

People get suspended / and or change usernames for too much flaming and specifically promoting and or trying to sell things without permission.

Wayne and Herb are both promoting here without permission.

By contrast, permission is granted implicitly for side discussions that have relevance and explicitly for threads that have a focus on religion. See Chris, Alfredo, Andrew, Randy, et al.. for many excellent examples of this.

These things are acceptable and healthy. They serve to limit discussion according to the group dynamic in play here.

Inserting it everywhere is nothing more than spam --and it's on our collective dime. It's also on Dan's dime in that he will see a reduction in overall activity. That costs him to run the venue.

Well I guess I am guilty as charged.

Yeah. You are. But you are an example of why we can't be labeled, like Wayne accuses, that " we only want to hear from people we agree with."

Because, well, you are good and normal and THINK. I can handle ANYONE who operates that way. ESPECIALLY the ones I don't agree with.

Author: Kbbt
Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 1:42 pm


No.

We should ban people abusing this forum. Specifically, taking every available (and not so available) opening to push their shit onto others, who may or may not be interested.

Randy, I too am now in favor of some stronger moderation. IMHO, we can keep it real --even tolerating the occasional spat, without having to deal with this.

I'm all for it and will abide by whatever rules come as a result of it. --Just not gonna invest in it, until I see I'll get something back in return.

Sorry all, but I've given too damn much to feel

------
Shall we ban everyone who is a Christian?

Hey, to be clear, Chris is on the very good side of things. Stand up poster, to whom I hope to measure up to one day.

Totally guilty as Charged!

No. Just you.

Why just me? I am not the only Christian on this forum.

thump thump thump . . .

once again, I've learned more from chris about religion than I learned from the thumpers at the various catholic churches I had to attend as a child.

If the thumping trolls in here would take a few lessons from chris, they'd be able to discuss various topics without being called a troll or thumper, but alas, they choose selfishness.

BOTH of them are trolls. Both need to be moderated out of the forum. They've pooped on Dan's website long enough.

How about a new thread

Wayner & Herb Live from the Pulpit

I wonder how many will be sitting in the pews of that congregation?

/couldn't resist

Wayne said " Why just me? I am not the only Christian on this forum."

Yeah. Exactly. It has nothing to do with you being a Christian. You may as well claim that because you are right-handed, we wish you weren't here. You do this all the time Wayne; You get this false thing in your head, assume that that's the reason we don't like you and then never shut up about it. All the time when are saying " NO WAYNE! It's not WHY you think - it's that you DON'T THINK. You don't listen. You contribute NOTHING to further ANY conversation. NOTHING." It's all the other things about you that makes you unwelcome. Your stubborness. Your closed-mindedness. Your unwilling to have anything proven to you that would cause you to change your mind on any given topic. Or at least admit that other points are more accurate than yours. You are not without fault, Wayne. You should start admitting that, out loud, more often. I mean, look at how tritely you stepped all over a very personal experience from MissingK; You trampled all over valid points, honest facts and tons of other crap just because you feel justified by the fact that you have FAITH. It's wrong to do that in the way you do it Wayne. You will answer for that someday.

You strut around all pious because you have faith. BIG DEAL! We ALL have faith of some kind. Nobody else thinks that everything stems from that. You do.

That's why you don't operate very well within a group like this. You want to say things and let it go unchallenged. NO! You are NOT smart enough to do that for us. You like to think that you have no flaws and can't be incorrect about any facts or beliefs. Even when you are SHOWN, POINT BLANK, that you were mistaken, you change the subject or ignore that point. Or both.

That makes you a bad person, Wayne. Not a terrible person. But you live your life with such simplicity that you get confused and scared when anyone shows you that the world is not like you. It never has been.

If we took everything you said as truth, we'd have a LOT to answer for as we cleaned up HUGE messes within society. You further no discussion. And that kind of backwards thinking is detrimental to the human race. Thank GOD you have nothing but your faith. Because if you truly had any influence, you'd be in MUCH bigger trouble than getting called out on a message board.

I think when you say " pension " you may actually mean " disability."

bingo re: cj's last sentence in his post

Believe me, increased moderation of the forum will kill it. It's the free expression here without repercussion that makes it work. Don't wish for the death of the forum. I for one think Dan does an outstandng job in his approach to running the place.

If Wayne and Herb want to cheapen their religion by dragging it into the dust and dirt and politics of this forum, let them do it. Just don't respond.

"Do you think we should ban Christianity?"

How do you propose we go about banning the spiritual inner of a human being?

*thump thump*

I am sure you would be happy if we were banned wouldn't you? We have been banned before.

And Deane I can't keep silent like you probably want me to. I have as much right to speak my mind as any atheist.

Author: Chickenjuggler
Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 3:35 pm


Wayne said " Why just me? I am not the only Christian on this forum."

Yeah. Exactly. It has nothing to do with you being a Christian

------
I think everyone else knows its the truth but you. Your argument is with my faith and not with anything about me personally. You need to realize that there are people with faith in God. Atheism should not be a requirement to speak one's mind here.

thump thump thump and pooping . . .

OK - you win, Wayne.

You ruined it all for me.

I'm outta here too. You are not worth any of it.

Wayne is Herb
Herb is Wayne

I will do my best to not respond to, converse with, or give the time of day to either. Thought maybe he could be saved like Luke saved Darth Vader but alas he is to far gone to ever return to the real world......he exists now only in Waynes_World!

L8R

Kbbt- I appreciate your kind words. Was moved and humbled by them.

ct

Heck...check this....he even puts words in Paul Anka's mouth for him to:

Paul Anka Gold, April 26 2003
Reviewer: wayne balzer (portland, oregon United States) - See all my reviews
What I want to know is does anyone know of a CD collection that contains Paul's original ABC hits from 1957-61? There used to be a label called Sire which had such a collection but unless one can find it as vinyl in some used record store, its unavailable. Its a shame, because the CD thats on my left, the "21 golden hits" version on RCA are all remakes, which sound terrible. Even Paul, I've read, regretted making it.

I'm sure he said that.......NOT. Using the National Enquirer as a source is not acceptable!!

http://www.amazon.ca/Five-Decades-Hits-Paul-Anka/dp/B000000D0U

So what does that have to do with anything?

thump thump thump and pooping on the forum.

Wayne's World
Wayne's World
Party time, excellent...
Wayne's World
If you don't believe in God your a GD Liberal
Wayne's World
Wayne's World
Pinko Commie Sadam Lovers
Wayne's World
Wayne's World
Every Liberal is going to hell
Think like me our your a Liberal
Wayne's World
Wayne's World
Your going to hell cause you don't think like me
Wayne's World
Wayne's World
Party time, excellent

Trix the Commuinist. I am intolerant according to him because I oppose gay marriage. There is no other way to define "tolerance" but that.

thump thump thump, poop poop poop.

No argument, eh Skeptical?

Poop poop poop.

For once I agree with Deane. We need to keep this forum a place for free expression. We all can then choose whether to participate in each topic or not. I for one have been sitting out on many topics as I read the posts and realize that it degenerates into either 1. Name calling, or 2. A religious discussion with no hope of enlightenment. In other words, no one is going to learn anything or change any minds.

But, I hold to the principle of freedom of speech. And, diversity of opinion.

For instance, the only two things I can see that Wayne and I have in common are these:
1. We both like The Beatles.
2. We both are Christians.

After that, we diverge. But that doesn't make it okay to personally attack, or name call. It means we have some basis to start from.

Keep the forum going, with all members, and upgrade the quality, that's what I propose.

Well said. But we can discuss religion. We just have to be a bit more tolerant here. Unfortunately when people identify tolerance solely with homosexuality its very hard to carry on a gentlemanly conversation. Its what I wish would happen and it sounds like you do to. We don't build each up by putting each other down.

thump thump thump, poop poop poop.

Fix your headache would you? Take advil and call me in the morning!

poop poop poop, thump thump thump.

I tried to give them two yaywhos the benefit of the doubt but now just realize they are of no benefit.

You're getting an inkling of why some long-time posters feel the way we do.

This will be my last post on PDX Radio for at least the time being. Since I'm withholding donations I won't be a freeloader by continuing to post.

From Waynes_world:
We just have to be a bit more tolerant here.

Yeah, you first.

Wayne, trust me. We disagree on your homosexuality issue. Completely. So, sorry, I guess I'm out on that one also.

Author: Aok
Monday, November 27, 2006 - 11:10 am


From Waynes_world:
We just have to be a bit more tolerant here.

Yeah, you first.

----
You only mean gay marriage. Tolerance means nothing else to you but that.

Author: Warner
Monday, November 27, 2006 - 11:37 am


Wayne, trust me. We disagree on your homosexuality issue. Completely. So, sorry, I guess I'm out on that one also.

------
The problem is, Warner,that we can't disagree on that issue. I either support gay marriage or I am bigoted and discriminatory. I wish we could disagree about that matter.

poop poop poop, thump thump thump . . .

"I either support gay marriage or I am bigoted and discriminatory."

That's worth a post.

Honest finally. Congrats Wayne!

That's something others can live with. By this statement, you are finally not hiding behind your religion. Good for you. I can respect that, and also choose to disagree.

Maybe gay marriage is too much for you. I'm ok with that and won't judge, save for the simple plea that you try...

Equality is not a one way street, nor is is something we can just take when we want it and leave when we don't.

Saying that God essentially wills you to be a bigot is wrong. It is exactly the wrong that's offended many here.

Want a confession? A similar show of honesty?

I'm none to happy about the idea of mixed race marriages. Bothers me that we might blur the different kinds of people into just one kind.

Would prefer it didn't happen.

But, I'm not gonna try to legislate that, nor will I hide behind religion. It's my issue that I must deal with. To deny this, or dodge, is just less than honest and it sucks.

You are the same way with gay marriage.

Equality often sucks, still it is there demanding our tolerance for one another.

When people here ask for support, this kind of response is perfectly ok. It's honest and easily a point where we can disagree.

The big problem with "god says so" is where matters of faith are not clear.

eg: Murder -vs- anti-gay

Faith is clear enough on this matter to make no mistake. Killing another is wrong --and something to be avoided, if at all possible.

The result is our law closely reflects where faith is at on the issue for a high percentage of Americans.

On the matter of anti-gay, faith is not clear. Not clear at all, and as such can be used to justify any position. This marginalizes it's value where making law and other decisions are concerned.

Faith, no matter what yours happens to be, has not spoken on this matter with enough clarity to be authoritative, yet you post here as it that is indeed and in fact the case.

It just isn't and again, that sucks, but that's where we are at right now.

Therefore, using your faith to support and justify your bigotry is not honest, and becomes the source of significant conflict the more it is done.

Anyway, that's my big beef.

At least making the statement you did, is honest and respectable --even if we don't have room for agreement today.

Your big beef is with my lack of support for gay marriage. I would appreciate it if you would least understand why I object to that.Its not very honest to use terms like bigotry and discrimination when you only mean gay marriage and nothing else. I don't hate gays at all. Marriage doesn't guarentee that the hatred will die. Why can't that be seen here? I don't think we will ever agree about this matter so I would appreciate it if we could drop it and talk about something else. The world doesn't revolve around homosexuals. Peace.

Why don't you just leave them alone??
Hell, they leave you alone.....

I leave them alone I just don't want them to marry like you probably do.

Wayne; The smartest and best thing you've ever said here is this: "The world doesn't revolve around homosexuals."

Perfect. You are so right. Let's all move on. Including all those on the right who want to make it a dividing point.

Thank God you've finally seen the light.

Next topic?

Hey! Let's talk about Nixon and Pinko Commies...

I am getting tired of the topic too.

And the poop continues to rain down upon thee...

POOP!

No argument, Trix?

Crap On! Crap Off!

Anyone got a glade stick on for in here??? It really smells like crap in here anymore with all of the pooping going on all of the time!!!!LMAO

I think we need a movie-set-quality fan, you know, like the kind they used in the movie "Twister".

It's a freaking crapper for sure!

I've thought about it some though. Changed user names out of protest. I'm gonna leave that in place as a reminder.

There are more solid people here than not. Perhaps Warner has it right and we all just need to focus.

now, where was that big ass fan!

It's a mess, but not one that has to endure.

mrs m, boeing has a spare jumbo jet engine that I could borrow from my friends in seattle, if you're willing to supply the fuel. (It uses Jet-A kerosene, 250 pounds per minute.) It'll both clear the air and burn off the residue.

I've got plenty of Natural gas! (Botta bing)

take it to rev ebel's church and fire away.

Too funny Skep!

Would that just scare the hell outta them, or what? First the the election, then this!

Can the bunker hold 'em all and WW, or just the Ebel family?

Ever notice the turrents on the corners of that church? they've got the capability to shut down I-205 if things get bad enough -- and our closest tanks are up at Fort Lewis. (Those relics at the Vancouver Barracks don't count)

I'm also thinking the Ebels are hiding a ufo under that massive roof -- unfortunately there is no comet headed this way for a year and a half. I'm sure there is a lot of heated discussion underway at Bunker Ebel about what to do.