**** Rules For Dealing With Forum Trolls ****


1.) Never, ever attempt to take down a Forum Troll on your own. There is usually one in hiding just waiting for a opportunity to sneak up on you.
2.) Never disturb a Troll while they are sleeping.
3.) Never under any circumstances bring a Forum Troll into the real world with relevant discussion. They will evolve into Ogres and start to walk among us in public.
4.) Remember that Trolls are instinctive hunters and will set out bait and wait for an unsuspecting forum dweller to take it and then attack.
5.) Make sure you have plenty of Troll repellant with you. Troll repellant are things such as facts that substantiate any posts that you make.
6.) Last and most important! Never, ever, ever feed a forum Troll. Forum Trolls have an insatiable appetite and must feed continually. Troll food are such things as threads with interesting or controversial titles, threads with more than 20 posts, but the food the Troll wants the most is your posts when you take the bait that he sets out for you. If you have a strong enough will and presence of mind you can carefully avoid direct responses to the issues or comments that the Troll bait contains.

These Rules When Observed Can Make Your Journeys Through The Forum Forest Safe And Free Of Troll Attacks.

Is it just me, or does it seem quiet around here tonight.

For the record, I did send Dan a donation last night.

I've one planned for the near future.

(gotta pay ugly bill first...)

He's taking some crap. Well worth it, IMHO.

Ya it is quiet in here tonight...were is Wayne and Pete...you don't suppose they got a timeout or something do ya!

I'm missing RIPete. Otherwise, it's quite enjoyable to not have to wade past the other guy's posts!

We can only imagine what kind of crap Dan's email box is filling up with tonight.

RIP had (still has ?) his place here and his frustration level is understandable, but posting someone's partial address along with hinting at possibly, well, taking matters into his own hands isn't cool under any circumstances.

The controversy was good but I got tired of being called a leftist all of the time. And the fact that the man would never see anything anybody else's way. You can only pound you head on the wall so much. He did make it interesting but it was a broken record. Hope to see em again and that they both have a good holiday.

So pete finally got himself banned huh?

about time some one got rid of that racist jerk

I kind of pictured RIPete with a flashing necklace & saying "Norman Coordinate" before "going dark".

cochise, you're not in any position to comment on the behavor of others.

hmmm, I think I am in perfect position to comment. I never remember calling Native Americans drunks who rob liquor stores.

Might not like my views but I dont turn to namecalling to express them.

The guy was a jerk, If he was republican you all would be glad he is gone.

good riddance

I don't know what reinstate wrote and I don't anything about the guy except he's pretty far 'progressive.'

My GUESS is that it must have crossed the line.

If you guys would go after the idea not the person, and do it in a civil manner, you wouldn't have to worry about getting muzzled.

What does that say about the lack of civility in discourse from the left?

Herb

Here we go again. HERB is the only right handed player here guys.....all of us lefties lack civility!

How many times do people here have to tell you guys that some of us actually Mid field leaning Right. I agreed with Wayne on some points and disagreed on others but resented the way he tried to shove it down my throat and when I did not agree he like you just played the leftie card. I am asking you please in a civil language to please stop with all of the labeling that is going on. No one label cant fit any one person and even you can agree to that...Right?

Whatever happened happened....lets just move on! Herb I know and trust we can hear from you with civil and factual posts when you disagree on issues. If I am ever wrong with you in a debate I promise to eat my share of crow due me!

He may not be posting but I know he is reading

Have a Merry Christmas Wayne!


Have a Great Holiday Pete!


Season's Greeting's Joamon

RIP is a solid contributor here, who got frustrated.

That's it. A vacation will do him good.

Oh, and Herb, your team took it in the sack!

Take it easy RIP! It will be over before you know it! ---->KSKD

"...please stop with all of the labeling that is going on."

"HERB is the only right handed player here guys.....all of us lefties lack civility!"

You might have credibility if you didn't continue doing what you accuse me of doing.

Why is it that you and Trixter try to convince others how conservative you are? It should be obvious, otherwise if it quacks like a duck....

Herb

And this is the trouble with generalizations of this kind!

Civility is pretty high right now. If there is a problem, why not put it on the floor instead of just attaching it to the "left"?

(Munches on popcorn, passes bowl to Herb.)

Well I am certainly out of touch. So Pete and Wayne are both gone?

Wayne always said there would be someone else to replace him. It will be interesting to see if that manifests itself in time.

It really is too bad it came to this for both of them.

Takes snort of JD.
Herb...I just used that as an example of labeling!
I am pretty much mostly a moderate and play center field myself but I do play both of the other fields depending on the issue at hand!
I never tried to convince anyone of anything other than that. But I am not a liberal nor am I a conservative per se'.
Right now I am just losing my roof so I guess in a while you can just call me a convertible!

I'm hoping they are just on a vacation...

Both have been contributors here for a very long time.

I'll drink to that....tips bottle of JD taking huge snort! AAhhhhhh...hair of the DOG!!!! Good Stuff......!!!!

When is Herb gonna be banned for just being an EXTREME RIGHTIE???

Trix - nah, Herb shouldn't be banned. We disagree with the level of his right-ness, but he makes a point and doesn't suggest that we're terrorists, or bad Americans or Saddam haters or horrible parents or whatever. I have yet to see Herb put words in my mouth and accuse me of such things. He is a man of faith, which is fine, but he isn't telling me I "need Jesus in my life".

THIS is someone I can talk with.

I earnestly attempt to use reason within a secular context. However when it comes to matters of faith, Jesus is there for all of us.

Herb

From RIP:

Greetings and salutations good posters of pdxradio, and Herb. As you have probably figured out by now, I pushed the limits of pdxradio and got 86'd like a PETA member at Schumacher Furs . Or as the page says, "your account has been suspended by board moderators..." I'm not sure if it's permanent or temporary. So, I've been reduced to posting by proxy.

I think it's obvious to everyone here, even Herb though he won't admit it, that Wayne was the problem on this board and should have been 86'd a while ago after it became apparent that the quality of the forum was suffering greatly due soley to him. This has nothing to do with his conservative views. Wayne was an extreme disruption and provided a net-loss value to this forum. After all, only a few weeks ago did the "other side" exceed the number of posts on the radio side. Today the "other side" has 4000 more posts than the radio side. Wayne drove the entire board to the brink of berserkerness, me included. It appears that Wayne has been 86'd as well, so good riddance to him! The effect Wayne had on this board is now becoming evident by the last few days of a return to civil discussion without Wayne dropping dung on every thread. He was worse than Jakman, believe it or not, and that's certainly a feat I thought I'd never see achieved here.

Unfortunately, in my effort to drive Wayne away from the board, I also became a casualty of pdxradio, and have been forced into early retirement before I can collect Social Security. Look at it this way: At least Wayne has been silenced. Is this Mission Accomplished? Can you consider me a martyr? I suppose I could create another user name, something like Reinstatereinstatepete, and jump back in, but I don't think I'll be doing that. The smarter ones on the board would call me out in a minute.

Merry Christmas to you all, including Herb.

Reinstatepete

Oh, and OBAMA 2008!!!

Pete is gone? Its about time.

He pushed the limits far too long and this needed to happen long ago.

"I think it's obvious to everyone here, even Herb though he won't admit it, that Wayne was the problem on this board and should have been 86'd a while ago after it became apparent that the quality of the forum was suffering greatly due soley to him. This has nothing to do with his conservative views."

Reinstate.

If Wayne were a democrat, it's abundantly clear that everyone, you included, would have cut him a LOT more slack.

If indeed your problem with Wayne had NOTHING to do with his political views, it's interesting that you continue to single me out as you did on your post today. I earnestly believe that it is partially because I'm one of the few consistently conservative voices on this board.

I can't prove that, but your vitriol appears usually pointed toward anything conservative.

Personally, I wish no one would be banned from here, provided that they treat others civilly. I don't know Wayne and I won't pretend to speak for him, but without regard to the content of his posts, Wayne at least attempted to behave in a civil manner.

And Reinstate, if you actually believe that you're victorious...EVEN if that means being banned from this board, you do a great disservice to the concept of free speech.

That's because in your scorched-earth policy to silence someone else, you've effectively silenced yourself. In chess, it's like sacrificing one's queen for the other's queen. In doing so, you have therefore placed yourself on a par with Wayne. And given your blinding hatred toward the guy, what does that say about your own opinion of yourself?

In sports, a tie said to be like 'kissing one's sister.' Think what you want, but what you've done is merely tied with the Waynester. You cannot claim any meaningful victory.

Why do I defend Wayne? Because (1). He's always outnumbered here, (2). Like him or not, he often speaks the Gospel truth, (3). Attacks against him here are awfully mean-spirited while intending to bait him, and (4). I often agree with him, though sometimes we have a slightly different take on things.

Reinstate, what you've practiced is essentially censorship, the absolute opposite of what democrats claim to represent. I look forward to the civil Reinstate returning, because you do offer some interesting perspectives.

Merry Christmas to you, Dan and the Waynester.

Herb

"I don't know Wayne and I won't pretend to speak for him"

Herb
That is a great statement and a great example of the one thing I did not care for from him. He did not know me either but he did essentially put words in my mouth and speak for me. Beyond that I thought him tollerable. I don't dislike the man, don't know him, but it was him putting words in my mouth that made me, and maybe other's, angry at him.

Merry Christmas to Him!

Me thinks we take ouselves a bit too seriously on this board at times.

AMEN to that! (Hand Raised)

I have a feeling that Pete using other people to post here for him is only going to keep him from being allowed back to post.

In that case, i hope he continues.

There will be only one post by proxy from me.

IMHO, there are some really rough feelings. That's part of why I went ahead and forwarded his message. I think it's gonna be difficult, maybe this will help, that's all.

Missing, I appreciate you giving RIP an opportunity to respond to what has transpired.

I would have done the same even though I have mixed feelings about him. Hopefully he will be reinstated after a time out.

Don't forget, Pete went way over the line. I would be surprised if he would ever be allowed to return.

I guess it would also be appropriate that I say Wayne was destroying the forum and needed to be removed.

Well, not to put too fine a point on it, but it does feel nice to breathe for a while. And it had much less to do with the beliefs than the just - ugh - you know what I mean.

That's not a question.

I KNOW, I KNOW, I didn't always help things either. Makes it easier to be better though. And for that, I am grateful.

Hey, we can have a meta!

ReinstateReinstatePete!

Coupla lessons here for all of us, IMHO:

-there are lines, push hard, but don't push so hard as to be abusing friendships here.

Randy, I see where you are coming from. I did it because each of us works a different way. For me, a coupla days thinking things through, without the distraction of continuing to interact did wonders.

I'm not afraid to say it, because honesty is always best. Eventually all is good and we can move on.

For others, in the past, it's taken time. Maybe RIP needs this, so there is no harm. It will take the time it takes.

Anyway, that's all on this topic.

Let the healing begin, and heed the words Chris shared with us: we do take ourselves too seriously. Better to take the friendships more seriously than our own selves!

Wayner DUH complainer is gone????

WOW!

No more cramming the Bible down our throats......

I'm glad Herb is still here!!!

Aw, you're too kind.

I don't want to speak for them, but for now it appears to be me, D.D. and Deane as the token non-democrats remaining.

Herbert Milhous

even "impeach clinton" republicans are abandoning the GOP. see thread elsewhere

Interesting...

From what I can gather, a couple of notorious posters have been banned. Obviously, a tough call for the owner/moderator of the site, but a call that needed to be made.

So the site may be a little more "quiet" without them, but maybe it will bring this site back to more of a civilized discussion of politics and other things, and at the end of the day, that would be a good thing.

Very rarely (and reluctantly) do I have to ban people from posting. In the case of the two referred above, I sent them email outlining the reasons. One had a disabled email account and therefore, I guess, felt the need to communicate thru another member rather than directly to me.

Yes, let's hope we can get back to a more civilized and less person-centric tone in the posts.

Mahalo

Your points are well-taken, Dan.

I probably contributed to the problem and will follow your suggestions.

Thanks for not banning me, as I know you easily could have.

Herb

Dittos to the statements above. (I'm not really a dittohead, I just use some of the lingo on message boards.)

Most of us probably didn't handle the situation as well as we could have and hopefully we've learned something. As Missing stated in another thread, we were often putting out fire with gasoline. (Now I have a David Bowie song stuck in my head.)

Herb>> Thanks for not banning me, as I know you easily could have.

That could apply to most of us.

VERY TRUE Randy!

That is why I backed off and stayed away for a while....

Bring back Wayne!

If Dan agrees, it would be nice to have Wayne back.

However, it's his forum and I'm not going to second-guess him.

If Wayne IS brought back, I thought of one way to perhaps better partition the discussion so that those hostile to matters of faith can effectively opt out:

I don't know how difficult it would be to set up, but maybe there's a point to having a THIRD section devoted to Religion.

My thought is that because many people of faith derive their political values from their religious belief, most of the political sessions at one time or another appear to work that direction.

Just a thought. Who knows, maybe it would overtake the political board like the political board overtook the radio side. Anyone else want to weigh in?

Herb

IMHO the main reason for the Politics & Other Things, is to draw the inevitable side discussions from the serious radio discussions.

In that, I think it succeeds.

If we want to have religious discussions, there are other venues.

Remember, this board is supposed to be about Radio.

People .... wake up!

It's not easy to be banned, so once banned let no one be reinstated. They can always come back as "*&^%_2" or better yet, under a totally different handle. Their true personality/agenda will be clearly evident, leading to being banned again if they don't play by the rules, few as they are.

There are thousands of discussion boards pertaining to religion, let those whom wish to thump their bible GO THERE.

It would be one thing if said religious attitude occasionally made its opinion known in a thread where it might be appropriate, but not to the point where it becomes, as it has, an impediment to the exchange of all ideas. It is not the opinion or topic that has been banned, which one might be led to think based on Herb's post above, but rather it is the behavior of individuals. Surely even the most opinionated can conform to some basic rules of discussion forum etiquette. If not, good riddance.

Shalom!

Andy

I would prefer to not have Wayne back here. I do miss RIPete, I think he just had a gutful of WW and snapped. He's been here a long time.

So has WW, but he ususally stuck to the radio side, and his new-found zealotry is just too much, and causing too many problems, and making this a place of less interesting and viable discussions. It seems every single topic comes back to Wayne's repetitive, factless and opinionated agenda.

I also prefer to not have or read a religion forum, so I'm with Amus & Andy (gosh, I wanted to write that!) on that idea, go somewhere else for that. I don't think we need to do it on Dan's dime.

Just my .01

I never agreed with anything Wayne said, but I respect free speech. He was not the worst offender either. Some of you who I totally agreed with, were just as insensitive as Wayne and sometimes even meaner, yet you get to stay.

Wayne was never really mean...don't think he had it in him like I was to him on times. However when I was wrong I would eat my crow and admit my error's. I would also post fact's when asked to backup any case or issue I was trying to make. Wayne never did either of these and that is what the main difference was. I am not better or worse than him but do observe general rule's for discussion and when asked a question I will try to answer as best I can. He did not have the ability to ever see anything through another's eye's so it was always his way or you were wrong. Not very condusive to civil discussion's!

To Amus & others-

Since this is a radio board, your post can modified to make my point:

"...If we want to have POLITICAL discussions, there are other venues. Remember, this board is supposed to be about Radio."

Your attack on a religion thread simply appears to be another ham-fisted attack against faith-based political thought.

To deny that faith and politics are interconnected is to deny reality. Either support a faith-based thread or cut some slack to those whose political beliefs are shaped by their faith.

And hey-if it keeps the Waynester out of the politics thread, you atheists should be thanking me.

Herb

Attack?

I offered an opinion.

That and $2.50 will buy you a Latte.
Sorry. I thought you wanted a civil discussion.
My mistake.

As for the fists..

Mmmmmm Hammmmm.

It's hard for me to make a fist sometimes...what with my knuckles dragging on the ground all of the time.....you know me and my neanderthal way's of thinking! I just prefer using my "Captain Caveman" club and just Bonk people with it instead of Ham fisting them!

When I found we could have some brains
I was the first in line, cause we were, like
Dragging our knuckles along the ground
(dragging our knuckles along the ground)
Ever since, I've been convinced that every
Sacred thought is mine, and you were still
Dragging your knuckles along the ground
(dragging your knuckles along the ground)

Cause I think I'm there, dude (don't get ahead of yourself)
I think I'm there, dude
(Already high)

And when they asked us who will lead
I thought it surely must be me
But I stood up too fast
(I stood up too fast)
Because as soon as I was boss
The next one in line took my head clean off
Cause I stood up too fast
(I stood up too fast)

I was barely in my teens when I decided I was tired
Of always like dragging my knuckles along the ground
(dragging my knuckles along the ground)
So with all due haste I based until I got so freakin wired
Forgot I was dragging my knuckles along the ground
(dragging my knuckles along the ground)

I thought I was there, dude (you'll got ahead of yourself)
I thought I was there, dude
Already high

And when they asked for volunteers
I must have thought they said 'drink beers'
And I stood up too fast
(I stood up too fast)

I can imagine things that can't possibly exist
And then I add them to an ever-expanding list
And when I've solved every significant test there is
Then I'll move on no matter how many clues I've missed

It's so easy to be smart but it's a struggle to be wise
You shouldn't be always throwing your weight around
(always throwing your weight around)
It's much better to be humble than to have a big hat size
Or you'll be just begging somebody to take you down
(begging somebody to take you down)

And you'll be nowhere, man (you got ahead of yourself)
And you'll be nowhere, man
Already high

And right before your very eyes
I have ignored my own advice
Cause I stood up too fast
(I stood up too fast)
And nobody has the slightest choice
But to put up with my droning voice
When I stood up too fast
(I stood up too fast)

Todd Rundgren

"Wayne was never really mean...don't think he had it in him like I was to him on times."

Yes, he was.

Whether it was calling others Communists or terrorists or "our hero Saddam" or stating that others are glad that Pearl Harbor happened or telling some of us how to raise our children as HE sees fit or questioning our Christianity because it didn't fit into HIS beliefs, yes, that is flat-out mean. I think questioning the patriotism of someone because they don't agree with HIS agenda, or simply pointed out the error in his math, is flat-out mean. He honestly seemed to go out of his way to offend anyone in here who did not agree in lock step with his views, and that is mean and unacceptable.

I welcome and embrace the tit-for-tat that most of us do in here, the discussion of different topics from different viewpoints. Whether it's Herb from one viewpoint or ... well, RIP when he was in from the other, it almost always seems to be without personal vendettas or agendas or finger-pointing or name-calling or baiting. Bringing Wayne back in would eradicate that and drive this whole thing back into the cesspool. When other long-time posters, valuable people to this little community, leave in droves because of ONE person, that is not right.

We're even debating bringing that ONE person back?

"We're even debating bringing that ONE person back?"

It's way above my pay grade.

Herbert Hoover

"It's way above my pay grade."

HAH! HAH!

Nice one Herb!

This is all too complex.

KISS: If you are abusing the friendships here, then it's time to back off period; otherwise, fire away! We all might learn something!

When people come back they will be as welcome as they were before period.

At least that's how I'm gonna play it.

Anything less seems to me to be petty and beneath what this forum has achieved in the past. I want that back, not any sort of goofy forum justice. Seems we are getting there now, and that's really the whole point of it.

Herb your just plain rude

"When people come back they will be as welcome as they were before period. At least that's how I'm gonna play it."

Sounds good in theory. Does that include Wayne?

Or given your wording: "as welcome as they were before..." would you not grant him the same benefit of the doubt, and instead continue to level ham-fisted attacks on the the guy?

Herb

Everyone.

My hat is off to you.

It's good to see the chance for redemption here.

After all, if it can happen with Miss USA, it's nice to know that it can also occur at PDXRADIO.COM.

Herbert Milhous

I stand corrected. Brian...you are correct...thpse comments were rude.

Missing....I also will welcome anyone back. If they learn from this whole thing and change their ways that is great. If it returns to same old same old then I will just take a vacation and possibly look elsewhere to post. I am not going through that again.

Seasons Greetings Everyone!

Herb,

I gotta ask,

You appear to be taking the high road here, and that's great.

Yet you post a suggestion,
I offer an opinion,
And you accuse me of making an attack.

What's up with that?

"You appear to be taking the high road here, and that's great."

You're welcome.

My response involved the complete dismissal of my prior sincere suggestion, which was intended to be helpful.

Since the Waynester had been so thoroughly trashed around here, and no one wants to '..wade through Wayne's posts...', I thought you'd be thanking me for taking him to a less political thread.

Silly me.

Herbert M.

Since this forum does not support free speech, I am resigning from it. I am much more liberal than conservative, but I cannot stand by and let you ban Wayne. I fought in Vietnam for the rights of such people to speak their mind, no matter how crazy they might seem. I saw too many people die for Wayne's right to sound crazy. This is not a true forum unless it is two-way.

Herb, please take over and demand Wayne's right to return.

Happy Holidays, Merry Christmas, have a good Ramadan and Hannaka (sp) and Kwanzaa.

Goodbye

Herb,

Just because I did not agree, that does not equal an attack.

It was not a complete dismissal.
I did preface it with IMHO.

Author: Radioblogman
Tuesday, December 19, 2006 - 9:35 am

"This is not a true forum unless it is two-way."

I would not mind Wayne being here if it were TWO-WAY as you say......but with him it was all HIS-WAY and nothing else...no discussion...just name calling and stirring people up into a frenzy trying to make him see the point of view!

Sorry to see you both gone but "C'est la vie"

And Happy Holiday's To You As Well

RadioBlogMan...Thank you for your service to our country.

I am saddened by those who first baited, then wailed on the Waynester when he responded.

The ultimate hypocrites are our friends who demand free speech for their rants, then want to squelch the opinion of others.

Herb

Herb

I have no problems with you and your beleifs as you discuss them in a correct manner. But from this point forward I will refrain from any posts in regard to any forum members no longer present. I see no need to drag out a bad issue any more than it has. It happened, time to move on.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

"The ultimate hypocrites are our friends who demand free speech for their rants, then want to squelch the opinion of others."

Sure, Herb. Pretty myopic on your part. Free speech is not Carte Blanche. When your kids were young and got in a "it's mine" or a "yes no" screaming match, did you not step in and demand silence?
Wayne stepped over the line time and time again. He (like you) love to bait the more liberal minded, if for no other reason than to justify your own rant. Wayne was a troll. He would post a reply not associated with the subject at hand, merely to interject his religious fervor. Most often it was misplaced. I truly think he'll be happier at some bible thumping board then here.

Earlier you wrote "To deny that faith and politics are interconnected is to deny reality. Either support a faith-based thread or cut some slack to those whose political beliefs are shaped by their faith. " The discrepancy, Herb, is that Wayne consistently tried to take a thread that WAS NOT FAITH BASED and morph it into one. So, he took the heat he deserved. And unfortunately, he could not take it the way he dished it out, and that's when things become a useless waste of bandwidth.

Herb said - " It's good to see the chance for redemption here.

After all, if it can happen with Miss USA, it's nice to know that it can also occur at PDXRADIO.COM."

And the Chickenjuggler laughed out loud at that.

VERY hard.

"Sure, Herb. Pretty myopic on your part. Free speech is not Carte Blanche."

Look.

You don't have a bone to pick with me. But I noticed you cleverly avoided confronting RadioBlogMan, who laid his life on the line so we can discuss things here freely.

And while I don't pretend to know what RadioBlogMan would say, he would probably be among the first to tell you that he KNOWS free speech is not Carte Blanche. ESPECIALLY WHEN THE MEDIA SLANTS STORIES AND PLACES OUR SOLDIERS AT RISK.

Nice avoidance tactic, though and I don't blame you for running. We're all pikers compared to those who have served in the armed services.

Herb

"But I noticed you cleverly avoided confronting RadioBlogMan"

He doesn't suffer from short sightedness. I've no reason to confront him on what he said, however, his posts do not accurately reflect Wayne's actions. Your post(s) I commented on talked about hypocrisy in regard to throwing out those that can not maintain a small sense of decorum, and about faith being picked out and attacked. It, too, was not a fair assessment of what has transpired. No avoidance on my part, even though you would like to paint it that way. Seems to me it's you trying to wrap yourself in a flag that belongs to RBM.

"Seems to me it's you trying to wrap yourself in a flag that belongs to RBM."

Nice spin. Here's what I wrote:

"We're all pikers compared to those who have served in the armed services."

Decent ham-fisted attempt, however.

Herbert Milhous Nixon VI

You say " ham-fisted " too much.

I'm not Jewish, but I think you should be banned for it.

I think you use the word "I" too much.

But because I believe in free speech, I DON'T think you should be banned for it.

Nor should Trixter be banned for using 'neo-con' too much.

That's the difference between you and me.

Herb

Which thread is this.....scrolling up....oh yeah!

Forgot about the rules!

Have a Nice Day!

Hey CJ

You get that Joke?

Just as your right to free speech doesn't allow you to yell fire in a crowded theater, nor does it allow Wayne to destroy a perfectly good message board to satisfy his need for attention.

Wayne was *not* exercising free speech, because he wasn't expressing an opinion... just stirring the pot and trying to exercise his personal demons. He was like the small child who acts out for attention- even bad attention is better than none. The phenomenon of "forum troll" is a well known one(although maybe not to everyone here), and in fact there are organized groups of them who take pleasure in destroying online communities.

Like it or not, there *are* restrictions on free speech, and Wayne had all the chances in the world to mend his ways. The board will be better without him, because he truely had nothing to contribute.

Amen.

And hallelujah.


Sorry, I have been out of the loop for a long time.

Troll sat alone on his seat of stone

Troll sat alone on his seat of stone,
And munched and mumbled a bare old bone;
For many a year he had gnawed it near,
For meat was hard to come by.
Done by! Gum by!
In a cave in the hills he dwelt alone,
And meat was hard to come by.

Up came Tom with his big boots on.
Said he to Troll: 'Pray, what is yon?
For it looks like the shin o' my nuncle Tim.
As should be a-lyin' in the graveyard.
Caveyard! Paveyard!
This many a year has Tim been gone,
And I thought he were lyin' in the graveyard.'

'My lad,' said Troll, 'this bone I stole.
But what be bones that lie in a hole?
Thy nuncle was dead as a lump o' lead,
Afore I found his shinbone.
Tinbone! Skinbone!
He can spare a share for a poor old troll,
For he don't need his shinbone.'

Said Tom: 'I don't see why the likes o' thee
Without axin' leave should go makin' free
With the shank or the shin o' my father's kin;
So hand the old bone over!
Rover! Trover!
Though dead he be, it belongs to he;
So hand the old bone over!'

'For a couple o' pins,' says Troll, and grins,
'I'll eat thee too, and gnaw thy shins.
A bit o' fresh meat will go down sweet!
I'll try my teeth on thee now.
Hee now! See now!
I'm tired o' gnawing old bones and skins;
I've a mind to dine on thee now.'

But just as he thought his dinner was caught,
He found his hands had hold of naught.
Before he could mind, Tom slipped behind
And gave him the boot to larn him.
Warn him! Darn him!
A bump o' the boot on the seat, Tom thought,
Would be the way to larn him.

But harder than stone is the flesh and bone
Of a troll that sits in the hills alone.
As well set your boot to the mountain's root,
For the seat of a troll don't feel it.
Peel it! Heal it!
Old Troll laughed, when he heard Tom groan,
And he knew his toes could feel it.

Tom's leg is game, since home he came,
And his bootless foot is lasting lame;
But Troll don't care, and he's still there
With the bone he boned from its owner.
Doner! Boner!
Troll's old seat is still the same,
And the bone he boned from its owner!

-- J. R. R. Tolkien