Well it's not the clutch. Checked it out --it's decent.

Had the co-worker (she knows little about cars and is single) try letting the car warm up for a long time.

Shifted great.

Anyone recommend some really killer trannie additives?

I'm suspecting a very worn syncro at this point. Maybe she can borrow some time to get through until next summer where that can get fixed.

What year and model Jetta is this? Do you know if it possibly has any hydraulic components that operate the clutch? Even though the car warmed up does not mean the gear oil did. Had a rice burner that worked fine until I got 5 miles down the road then after that forget 2nd gear up or down shift. Replaced synchro and was fine after that. Are you have problems in all gears or just one or two of them?

I think it's nearly all gears. It's a very early 90's Jetta. I'll have to get the year today.

Forgot to check for hydraulics. Will do.

It was an hour warm up. (I know costly if it's an everyday thing.)

So does in not shift good cold but after its warm it does OK?

Yep. Almost never has trouble when warm.

The heat expands metal, the soft metal in the synchro outer ring when cold is contracted emphasizing the wear and making the distance for that fork thingie to overcome more like a step.
Cold trans fluid also contributes to shift stiffness.

Additives IMO cause more problems than they fix.

Found this on another forum...may be useful:

Q: First gear grinds? <noise>
A: Shift into third thirst then shift into first.

Q: How can you tell if your synchro is REALLY shot?
A: Let the car idle, and with out depressing the clutch move the gear
shift into the gears you want to test.
If the synchros are more or less ok your idle will dip (or as I found out,
your car will start to move) w/o crunching.,
If however they are shot, you'll hear a big grinding sound.
Don't try it with the reverse gear, it has no synchro an will crunch
majorly.

An alternative is presented by Bill N Gallas:

1) Change the gear oil. If the car has >75K miles on the transmission
this could help as the extreme pressure lubricants in the gear oil do
wear out. This lubricant failure can manifest itself as syncronizer drag
and binding. After changing the gear oil you may notice the problem is
gone, :-) life is good!

If not:
2) Drive the car for 15 to 20 minutes to get the transmission warm.

3) Accelerate the car to 10 to 40 MPH for gears 1 thru 4.
a) engage the gear in question.

4) Leaving the clutch engaged, release the accelerator pedal.

5) If the gear select lever (gear shift) pops out of gear that syncro is
bad.

6) On most newer transmissions when first starting out in reverse
"ALWAYS" put the shifter into 1st gear, then shift to reverse. By
doing this you stop the transmission and will eliminate gear chip
damage to your reverse gear.

http://www.faqs.org/faqs/autos/vw/technical-faq/

"Don't try it with the reverse gear, it has no synchro an will crunch majorly"

as in broken gearbox

Either that or no teeth left on reverse gears so you have to use the open door and push backwards with your foot gear!

If it was good enough for Fred Flintstone...

Yabba Dabba DOO!!!

That was my favorite part about the Flintstones.

Especially when they go to the Drive-In for Bronto-burgers!

Sing it with me now:

Here we come on the run
With a burger on a bun
And a dab of coleslaw on the side,
Oh your taste we will tickle
With a great dill pickle
And all of our potatoes are french fried, fried, fried,
Our burgers can't be beat,
'Cause we grind our own meat,
Grind, grind, grind, grind, grind,


When you drive away,
You'll really hear us say,
We bid you bye, bye, bye, bye, bye,
We bid you bye, bye, bye, bye, bye!


And as you're on your way,
A tip upon our tray
We hope to find, find, find, find, find
We hope to find, find, find, find, find.

(My parents got so sick of us singing this, it was finally forbidden)

Your only suppose to drive it at night.

Haven't you heard of the Jetta Knight?

...a cold dill pickle.

I might have lost some sleep if I hadn't dug out the "Modern Stone-Age Melodies" CD (on Rhino) to verify.

Gotta love Rhino Records.

Funny, todays kids don't have anywhere near as cool of jingles. Instead of things like this in the car, we get hip-hop snippets... ugh!

Jetta getting trannie fluid changed. A mechanic checked out the clutch for sure. It's solid.

They are keeping the car overnight for a coupla days to see the problem replicated. (We found a free diagnostic service with fluid change near her home that's working out fairly well.)

Let us know what the final fix was....just curious!

Will do.

Still don't know the year. Forgot....

Hey, just got a chance to do the syncro test on my car. I know it's good, so I wanted to do it for reference.

It works just like it's detailed here. Car will creep along, if uninhibited.

So, what's a good amount of pressure to apply? In my car it didn't take that much to see some light motion.

Gonna try this on the Jetta next week and was just wondering where the acceptable limits are.

I'd idle the engine and just gradually increase the pressure until it either moves or grinds. Just go at it slow and not for any long durations and you should be OK.

kskd, if you had a toyota (or a honda or datsun or any asian-made car), I would have suggested the crusher treatment 2 weeks ago. Not only would the car look better, it would be $100 in your hand you don't have now. But I am rooting for survival for your Jetta.

Actually it's owned by a really great female co-worker, who does not know a thing about cars.

I've the toyota and as much as I hate to say it, It's quite likely the best car I've had.

Currently it's at 270K, does not use a drop of oil and regularly gets 35Mpg+ --made in 89!

It's ugly though...

Wow..an Jiffy Lube dream car....they don't even have to top of the oil they don't change!!!
LOL

I watch them like a hawk every time I take it in there.

Now that I've moved, I've a place to do oil changes without so much hassle. Will probably start doing my own again.

I get comments on that each time I take it there. I've had two problems:

-loose oil filter (Caught that with a quick check before driving off --earned me several free changes.)

-broken PCV valve fitting. (Dorks yanked the hose in cold weather without first relaxing the clamp.)

That earned me a batch more oil changes!

So far, Jiffy is losing with me. My average cost is about $10 because they hose it enough to warrant serious discounts.

When the joker broke the fitting, I made them fix it with new parts right on the spot, watching and commenting the whole time.

They've asked me repeatedly to just go inside and let them handle the tech stuff. Hilarious!

Even though you are watching...who's to say their oil gun is not hooked up to their waste oil tank and they just pump crappy oil back in. When I have to go to these places I always upgrade the oil to a packaged product. I usually only take it into Wally Mart once in a Blue Moon. Maybe going on a road trip and forgot about changing it myself and just don't have the time. It is very obvious in watching them that they use it. Check the filter to before I leave. Anytime they want to change the new PCV I put in I just laugh and say no, no, no, no, no, no, no to anything other that the oil change.

"who's to say their oil gun is not hooked up to their waste oil tank"

I suppose some sniffing of the dipstick is in order. (and I'm not talking about you-know-who)

Now that's just plain MEAN!!!! LMAO

The crappy old oil would probably smell better!!

What ever happened with the car?

Gonna check it out this week! I've been outta town.

Ok, it's all coming back around to the clutch.

The syncro test was a pass. Car didn't grind and wanted to move. I diagnose it worn, but acceptable.

Got a data point over the weekend that was interesting. Co worker has been thinking about this. After I told her how it all works together, she tried lifting the clutch pedal off the floor board with her foot.

She got an easy shift!

The clutch is not always doing this. It makes some sense that very cold could affect the clutch in this way.

So, we are now waiting for the next round of chilly temps and a few more incidents to occur. If a lift on the clutch does the trick, I'm sold.

Thanks everyone. I like this kind of thing because it puts the fine minds seen here to damn good use!

We are almost there on the Jetta without paying a huge bill! I'm tempted to just take some tools to work and see what adjustments can be made...

"she tried lifting the clutch pedal off the floor board with her foot."

?? I'm not sure I follow. But then I just woke up.

Prior to a shift, she lifted the pedal up to it's farthest distance from the floorboard, prior to performing a gear change.

After having done this, the gear change proceeded as it normally would.

Mechanically, that could indicate a hosed linkage or some other element that prevents a full disengage like someone else here suggested.


I'm gonna have to watch her do it to be sure. And have to see if it's in any way consistant. The syncro test compares with other similar cars I tried it in. Hers is not optimal, but not known bad either.

The jetta probably has a hydraulic clutch. I'd bet the master (maybe slave) cylinder is shot and needs replacement.

I suspect that "pumping" the clutch pedal a couple of times before trying to move the shift lever will do the same thing as lifting the pedal.

Although the master or slave cylinder may be shot, perhaps the hydraulic fluid is low or there could be air in the line. Mechanical link from pedal to master cyl and/or slave cyl to clutch may have excessive slop.

Sounds like the clutch hydraulics to me as well. Either have air in the system and justs needs bleeding or one of the two (or both) cylinders are bad!

perhaps the pressure plate springs are weak. if this is the case, "lifting" the pedal moves the throwout bearing entirely off the plate.

another possiblity: especially the mechanical parts ie: fork. it may be rubbing (hanging up) on something. In one case, ill-fitting headers caused this at low rpm whereas high rpms this never happened.

SO WHAT'S THE PRIZE FOR THE EVENTUAL WINNER???

I don't know! Her boyfriend is a member of a band. Bet I could get a CD!