Why people become Republicans

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Author: Missing_kskd
Monday, March 02, 2009 - 8:05 pm
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This post at 538 is excellent!

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/02/why-does-person-become-republican.html

Now, we've all talked about the 23 percenters. They've got some issue. Pro life, abortion, guns, religion, something. That issue is the "all in", "nothing else matters" issue for them. They might have a couple too. Doesn't matter.

They want it fixed dammit, no matter what the cost.

So, where are the other Republicans. There are financial elites, who prefer regressive taxes and bottom up wealth redistribution. Lots of those, but compare to the national numbers and they are top 5 percenters for a reason.

Then we've got the wanna be's. They are hoping to score that top percent and WANT THEIR SHARE AT THE TROUGH. Fair enough. I can identify with that.

Leaving ordinary people, who would otherwise be reasonable people.

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/02/why-does-person-become-republican.html

And there it is!

If they hear this messaging about "government can't work" and it couples with experiences like this, they develop that chip on their shoulder. Over time, this becomes a NOTHING ELSE MATTERS issue for them. They hate it, just like everybody hates it.

But, they buy in. They think it can be fixed by putting other reasonable people, like them, in charge.

That's the balance of the GOP, and this is that fraction that's seriously at odds with the Limbaugh + 23 + top percenters crowd.

I was once one of these reasonable people, who thought it was better to have other reasonable people in charge.

Now I know why that does not work, but it took a lot to get me there.

You guys?

Author: Broadway
Monday, March 02, 2009 - 10:31 pm
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I'm becoming more of a Republican everyday with this stock market.

Author: Trixter
Monday, March 02, 2009 - 10:35 pm
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A REAL Republican right?? Not a neo-CON that was in office for the last 8 years I hope. It funny now that YOU Republicans are not in charge (White house and Congress) that your using the Republican card. All YOU did was spend spend spend the United States into the mess we are in... But at LEAST your trying.... YOU have NO choice....

Author: Talpdx
Monday, March 02, 2009 - 11:13 pm
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I confess, I was more a Republican in my early years but saw the light in the early 1990's with the election of Bill Clinton as President. I couldn't tolerate the seeming intolerance of anything not white, straight and evangelical Christian at the GOP. The religious right had hijacked the party and many moderates fled in disgust. Remember Pat Buchanan’s speech at the 1992 Republican Convention – you’d think he was advocating a holy war. It was as incendiary as hell. Contrast that to the DNC Convention – like night and day. I did toy with the H. Ross Perot thing for a few minutes but found some of his supporters off putting at best.

On the one issue where I used to believe the GOP had some credibility, fiscal policy, they have completely lost me. They have ZERO credibility on the budget and their tax cuts for every ill approach is bad public policy. If you’re going to have a network of social programs, you’ve got to pay for them. In the Bush years, they took the easy route by cutting taxes but not cutting spending. If they had any balls, they would have made cuts where appropriate. I would have been opposed to making such cuts, but they would at least have some credibly.

Living in the modern world is not cheap. As much as I loathe wasteful spending and ineffective government programs, I don’t think the GOP approach of simply cutting taxes and not enforcing fiscal discipline is a viable model. We need to pay for the programs we have enacted. If they don’t work and are not longer relevant, sunset them. As for their social agenda, the GOP is caught in a middle ages time warp. They have let their social ideologues crowd out the moderates and that is very distasteful. Moderate GOPers hold their noses when voting for GOP candidates (I know one very well and he's ashamed and disgusted with the GOP – so much so he didn’t vote for President this last election).

Author: Broadway
Monday, March 02, 2009 - 11:42 pm
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>>All YOU did was spend spend spend the United States into the mess we are in

you've got to be kidding...and when we were "spending" the stock market was 12+thousand.
We are all going to experience more perilous times ahead with the current leaders financial concepts. The stock market has no faith in it...I fear for our country.

Author: Roger
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 7:18 am
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Interesting... I will have to think on that. I consider myself INDEPENDENT, but usually vote for more repubs then dems, throw in a few write ins especially if a candidate is UNOPPOSED on the ballot, and other parties from time to time.
AS FOR THE CAUSES.....

Abortion, not my fight. If I am in the position, I'll decide.

Guns, don't want one, you can have one, hell you can have 100, but you don't need a fully automatic assault rifle or bazooka, and if you use you gun to commit a crime, you go to jail forever!

Religion, you have yours, I have mine, leave it at that.

WE ARE. As soon as you tell me you are different and I have to treat you the same, then YOU are different. Black, gay, hispanic, blind, crippled, white male, heathen, alien, whatever, WE ARE!

Need help, I'll help. but expect you'll do the same when I need a little.

Fiscal responsibility. Yes. Take care of the needs, identify the wants. If there is money left over, work on the wish list. If you have to CREATE a program, make sure you can fund it. Make sure the benefits outweigh the costs. If you collect taxes for schools, use the money for schools, Roads, then use it for that. Put it all in a big pile,(general fund) then it gets frittered away in good times, with nothing finished at the end and you have nothing in the bad times. If you cut taxes, cut spending as well.

Passports for U.S. Citizens returning from Canada.
BULLSHIT. (personal peeve and a case of too much)

Author: Missing_kskd
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 7:26 am
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Unbelievable Broadway.

Are you really just shallow. You see the low number on the tee-vee and think, "those damn Democrats!"?

Seriously?

I fear for you man. Your level of willful ignorance astonishes me.

(and I didn't think that was still possible)

Author: Talpdx
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 8:16 am
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"The stock market has no faith in it...I fear for our country."

“Fearing for the country” sounds a bit melodramatic. I think you’ve heard one too many fire and brimstone sermons. You should thank George W. Bush; while he was at the helm of this massive economic Ponzi scheme of tireless GOP spending coupled with deregulation, he was able to drive home our current catastrophe. Send him a thank you note for helping create this facade of false affluence.

Sadly, the bubble burst, like most bubbles do. Only in this case, there is so much toxicity in the bubble that it’ll take years to free itself from this toxic sludge.

Both individuals and corporations borrowed too heavily – a prescription for disaster really if not managed efficiently. It has helped create an implosion that will take a good deal of time to sort through. Hopefully, we can learn from our mistakes, make appropriate changes to the regulatory environment, and move forward a healthier country and economy.

Now it’s time for the Democrats, (and the GOP if they can put their childish ways aside and make the country priority one; their Romper Room mentality is not very becoming of a country in crisis), to clean up the mess.

Author: Vitalogy
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 10:24 am
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The entire George W. Bush economy was predicated on insane borrowing by both business and individuals without tangible growth. The reality of the stock market we are seeing today is the result of the last 8 years of having no economic plan other than borrow and spend and hope it all pans out. Investors have no faith because they are now seeing the size of the grave Bush dug the last 8 years. And those that supported Bush (and still do) bear the blame for the current crisis.

As for why people become Republicans, I'm sure there are a variety of reasons, but the big one I see is that Republicans want to live in a perfect world. However, a perfect world is unatainable. Yes, it would be great if we had no government waste, nobody that needed medical care or food stamps, etc. Problem is, these issues exist and will never go away. Democrats are more realists in that we understand these issues exist and must be dealt with in order for EVERYONE to live in the best society possible. Republicans believe that if they are able to institute their ideology 100% everything would be dandy, and if that's not the case for you personally, too bad, try harder. As the last 8 years prove, that ain't the case.

Author: Trixter
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 11:01 am
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you've got to be kidding...

Nope! And if you don't/didn't see it then you need to take those rose/DUHbya colored glasses o ff. That's all DUHbya and Co. did for 6 years.... SPEND SPEND SPEND! Looking at it any other way would just be a flat out lie. Are you a liar? Hummmmmmm

Author: Roger
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 12:08 pm
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SPENDING.....

Not just for Repooblicats any more.

I kinda had the belief that the dems want to save the world, no matter the cost.

Solve the problems at home, THEN HELP save the world.

Author: Andy_brown
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 1:02 pm
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It's a lot easier than all of the explanations heretofore.

The Republicans see society as an upside down triangle. Specifically, the triangle is pointed down. The top is wealth and the bottom is poverty.

In statics, the analysis bears the obvious: The stability is low, the entire force of the triangle is focused on a single point. The pressure, therefore, is huge. The electrical analogy would be similar to passing a large amount of current into a wire that kept getting higher in guage (smaller in diameter). Eventually, the wire overheats and fails.

I'll leave the political and social analogy to others.

The Democrats on the other hand see the triangle as pointed up.
The statics are clearly different. The triangle is stable because the entire triangle's force is distributed along a wide bottom. Electrically speaking, this is atypical from any distribution network where the infrastructure at the head end is the most robust and the last mile is where the narrow wires are.

The country is composed of both wealthy and poor, but it's mostly middle class families that make up the bulk of the triangle. The last 12 of 14 years. the Republicans have controlled the flow of money towards themselves, forcing the middle to either rise to the broad top of their model or plunge into the narrow bottom. What happened is the bottom expanded much more than the top, leaving us with an hour glass shape, aka "the shrinking middle class." The backlash against this was huge, resulting in the power shift that has just taken place. Reinstituting controls over the economy will reshape the model back to stability. I'm enjoying the Republicans squirm.

Author: Aok
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 6:34 pm
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Broadway writes:

I'm becoming more of a Republican everyday with this stock market.

Well, I'm not sure if you heard this Broadway, but this whole mess brewed under the watch of YOUR party.

Obama was right, they cling to guns and God.

Author: Skybill
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 7:52 pm
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Obama was right, they cling to guns and God.

Well at least he said one intelligent thing.

The reason I became/am a Republican is that I don't agree with or believe in much if any of the Democrat's platform.

Simple as that.

Author: Broadway
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 9:37 pm
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>>but this whole mess brewed under the watch of YOUR party.

but now it's Obamanomics time and the stock market is not responding well and won't for sometime cause his policies are poor at best for many economist. Strap yourself in...more rides going down.

Author: Missing_kskd
Tuesday, March 03, 2009 - 9:56 pm
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This stuff takes time. The stock market is NO indicator of how we are doing, only how the wealthy are doing.

When we are stimulating the economy by providing jobs and empowering people, that takes time to trickle up.

How about we give that just as much time as we allotted for trickling down huh?

Seems fair right?

Author: Skeptical
Wednesday, March 04, 2009 - 12:00 am
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Yes, it does seem absolutely fair.

Gotta love how some here who have lost money under Bush are now unloading on Obama.

News bulletin: Making the rich rich again is low on Obama's priority list. Your chance of getting rich again was McCain . . . no, wait, Palin, yeah, that was the get rich quick ticket!

Yeah, right. Get in line and wait for the trickle up!

Author: Broadway
Wednesday, March 04, 2009 - 9:16 am
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>>The stock market is NO indicator of how we are doing

and how many people do you know that are out of work for months and can't even get a job at MickeyD's?

>>takes time to trickle up.

great, now we got trickle up economics...thank you Reagan!

>>lost money under Bush

and each day more Americans are scratching their heads wondering...what did we do!????

Author: Missing_kskd
Wednesday, March 04, 2009 - 10:04 am
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Again, the stock market is no indicator of how we are doing.

The state of jobs is mostly smaller business. Doesn't show up on the Dow.

Yeah, don't you love it? I sure do. Trickle up economics seems to be a fine starting point, if you ask me. We've done the trickle down bit for 30 years, and it sucks.

So, why not? Hell, let's be conservative about it. Give it 8 full years to see how it works. What do you say Broadway?

...or is it just better to feed that top 1 percent, so they will shut up?

I would much rather get those small business owners hopping and employing people. Screw the Dow. Let's go build stuff and make money.

Author: Chris_taylor
Wednesday, March 04, 2009 - 11:46 am
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Broadway like a messy divorce or personal bankruptcy it takes time and I mean time to not only work through all the financial implications but the emotional ones.

One pill does not solve this major problem. Not all of Obama's plan will work the way he wants it to. You learn as you go through the process. That's how bad this mess is.

Like a divorce, we are just beginning to sort out this mess and Obama has decided this stimulus package as step one. Yes like AA it's going to take steps and many will not be easy ones.

Broaday says:
"Strap yourself in...more rides going down."

Where have you been the past 8 years?

Author: Trixter
Wednesday, March 04, 2009 - 10:44 pm
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Well at least he said one intelligent thing.


Show us were DUHbya did?

Author: Washnotore2
Sunday, April 26, 2009 - 8:29 pm
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The reason the Republican Party has been losing elections is because it has been infiltrated by RINOs (Republicans in Name Only), who want to push their liberal views upon the entire party. They are not conservative and they have no business calling themselves "Republicans." Senators Olympia Snowe, Susan Collins and Arlen Specter (RINOs who voted for the Democrats' abominable bailout bill) are prime examples of this.

Many Republicans in the past few years did NOT stick to true conservative principles; they spent WAY too much and got embroiled in scandals. But no more. We will NOT kowtow to the RINOs; we are taking our party back and we will have a platform that will win.

Pro-Life, Pro-Gun, Pro-Family, Small government, Secure the Border, Anti-Illegal Immigration. That's our new conservative platform and we're gonna stick to it. The RINOs can either adapt accordingly or go join the socialist camp.

Author: Missing_kskd
Sunday, April 26, 2009 - 9:03 pm
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You go man!

Go big. Please.

Author: Chris_taylor
Sunday, April 26, 2009 - 9:29 pm
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"Pro-Life, Pro-Gun, Pro-Family, Small government, Secure the Border, Anti-Illegal Immigration. That's our new conservative platform and we're gonna stick to it."

Hmmm...Hasn't this always been the platform? Not seeing anything new here. Move along.

Author: Listenerpete
Sunday, April 26, 2009 - 9:53 pm
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They are not conservative and they have no business calling themselves "Republicans." Senators Olympia Snowe, Susan Collins and Arlen Specter (RINOs who voted for the Democrats' abominable bailout bill) are prime examples of this.

Gee Whiz! Didn't the bailout come from conservative Republican President George W. Bush?

Was President Ronald Reagan conservative? He doubled the FICA taxes on working stiffs and lowered taxes for the rich.

Author: Missing_kskd
Sunday, April 26, 2009 - 10:02 pm
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The natives are restless!

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0409/21677.html

Author: Roger
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 5:19 am
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....."Pro-Life, Pro-Gun, Pro-Family, Small government, Secure the Border, Anti-Illegal Immigration............

Is it ALL or nothing?

What if you are, Pro talk it over with involved parties then decide, I'm not in the position where I would need one so why should I decide if YOU can't have one.... You can have a gun, but not just ANY kind, SMALLer government, expand some understaffed units, combine some, eliminate some, all for families, Secure borders, but not to the extent of a North Korean type border, and certainly welcome immigrants who come in as the rules are currently written, but think maybe some quota on totals might be prudent until we get our financial house in order.

I think the party needs a little more depth....

Can you boil the dem party down to that few core values? I don't think the dem party is Anti Life, Anti gun, anti Family, big govenment, open border, pro illegal immigration......

I think both sides have been painted too simplistically and it only leads to continued polarization. I have an aunt who is a stong dem, never voted for ANYONE with an R next to their name, don't think she would vote for her own kid if he ran as an R, but is vocally against abortion, welfare, "them damn illegals", say's "why the hell would you want a gun, is for CAPITAL punishment, 1 appeal and then you hang, thinks torturing those Arabs was fine, and just about EVERYTHING ought to have a law, but there are too many laws, taxes are too high and the govenment ought to provide police and fire and that's about it. Talk about a mixed bag. Oh, BTW, she's ALWAYS right. Differ with her, she'll tell you to go to hell. Tell her the planet has a fever, she'll say how? with all the medicine that get's flushed the planet should be fine. Tell her our cars pollute too much, she'll tell you to take a bus or walk and she'll use your gasoline to go to the store. Tell her global warming is a real problem, she'll say fine, last winter was too damn long and cold, and she would like lower utility bills in the winter, those people shouldn't live on the coast if they're worried about flooding. She thinks the Indians should bunt more often, and the closer should have come in in the 8th inning.

She lived HER life, was all about HER family, and now older, hates all these government mandated changes and all the extra hoops she has to jump through regarding medical crap for seniors.

Sounds like neither party suits her needs or would be interested in courting her support............

Author: Vitalogy
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 10:36 am
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Nah, the reason the GOP is losing elections is that they don't represent the masses anymore.

So, if you want to continue to thin out the GOP, be my guest. The best way to do it is to go for the "Pro-Life, Pro-Gun, Pro-Family, Small government, Secure the Border, Anti-Illegal Immigration" folks.

Author: Skybill
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 11:26 am
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Yeah, but what percentage of the people approve of the job Congress is doing?

The last I heard it was around 20 something percent.

They are the ones that scare the crap out of me. Pelosi, Feinstein, Boxer, Reid and the AG Eric Holder.

The President is somewhat of a figurehead. It's the morons in Congress that really control things.

To quote one of my new favorite bumper stickers: "I'll keep my God, My Guns and My Wallet. You keep the Change"

Author: Vitalogy
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 11:47 am
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One thing is for sure: Democrats enjoy a 2:1 approval rating over their GOP counterparts in Congress. So yes, Congress's ratings are lower for the GOP than for the Dems. Carry on...

Author: Skybill
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 1:44 pm
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Wow. 2:1 that means tha 40 something percent approve or to put it in simpler terms;

60% Don't

Doesn't matter what side of the isle you are on with numbers like that.

Carry on indeed.

Author: Edust1958
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 2:32 pm
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If the overall like or dislike of Congress meant anything then there would not be so many incumbants... in reality, the only congressional approval rating that matters is the one for the individual member from his/her constituents. It doesn't matter to Pelosi if *I* think she is ill-informed and a political hack -- as long as her constituents are voting for her, she deserves to stay in office and present whatever views the majority of her constituents want presented.

Can I make a pitch again that the U.S. needs to have more the two major parties? Perhaps the social conservatives can form their own party and the social liberals but fiscal conservatives can form their own party....

Author: Chris_taylor
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 6:24 pm
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The Whig Party again?

Author: Amus
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 6:43 pm
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Here you go Chris!

Modern Whig Party

Recently there have been some Republicans who have submitted a resolution to call on the Democratic Party to rename itself the “Democrat Socialist Party.”

I would like to suggest the the Republican Party rename itself more appropriately.

Author: Missing_kskd
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 7:14 pm
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I think it is much better to just call them Republicans, and mix it up with GOP, just so everybody is clear.

Then, while doing that, hang the ugly ideology around their neck.

Again, just so everybody is clear.

Bad Economy? - Republicans
Illegal and Unjust War - Republicans
Torture? - Republicans
Class Warfare on the Middle Class? - Republicans
Home of the 23 percenters? - GOP

It goes on and on folks.

Republicans, Republicans, Republicans.

Author: Vitalogy
Monday, April 27, 2009 - 8:20 pm
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Marcia, Marcia, Marcia!

Author: Moman74
Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 12:18 am
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Missing: "Class Warfare on the Middle Class? - Republicans"

The Glass-Steagall Act was repealed under Clinton. Clinton ran as a progressive Democrat once in office he was told by _gasp_ Larry Summers that the Regan tax cuts would not be repealed. Clinton signed NAFTA. Clinton was about as blue dog Democrat as it gets when it came to fiscal policy. Hell he even had his own bubble economy. Remember the dot.com era? IPOs. Janitors trading stocks in the afternoons before their evening shifts. Then that bubble burst and W. picked up the pieces and built a housing bubble straight out of 1920's Republican strategy. Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

I cringe every time I see or hear Larry Summers. I think it's tragic that Obama picked that douche to help him with economics.

I did read the Wikipedia on the Modern Whig Party and I think that's absolutely brilliant. Regan Democrats and true fiscal conservatives joining up to make a new party. I hope it works out for them.

Author: Missing_kskd
Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 8:03 am
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Oh yeah, Clinton didn't do us any favors.

So then, Republicans + Clinton. I've no problem with that. But, it needs to be clear that it started with Republicans. Was thought up, tried, then Reagan sold it to us solid.

Author: Darktemper
Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 9:56 am
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The Real Reason "Why People Become Republicans or Democrats"

Oh, and here is an advanced preview of Sara Palin's Presidential campaign against Obama:
Palin for President


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